Aug. 4, 2025

Six Flags Cuts —What Happens When Cost Savings Kill Return Visits?

Six Flags just canceled its Christmas and Halloween events at multiple parks - will this save cost or cost more in lost visitors?

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TrendsSix FlagsHalloweenChristmas

Six Flags just canceled its Christmas and Halloween events at multiple parks—including Holiday in the Park at Great Adventure and Over Georgia, and Fright Fest at Six Flags America, which will now close permanently on Nov. 2. Michigan’s Adventure also dropped its Tricks and Treats event and will end its season on Sept. 1. The company says it’s “focusing on the core season,” but Philip and Scott aren’t buying it.
This week, the hosts break down what these cancellations mean for perceived value, season pass retention, and long-term brand equity—especially as Six Flags launches a new “Most Valuable Pass” offering access to all parks through 2026 for as little as $75. With year-round operations shrinking and aggressive discounting ramping up, is this a smart reset or a warning sign? And what happens when short-term savings override the emotional core of seasonal guest behavior? Listen to weekly BONUS episodes on our Patreon.

WEBVTT

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Oh right, here we go this week from our studios

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in Los Angeles and Tampa. This is Green Tag Theme

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Park and thirty. I'm Philip. He is Scott Twinson of

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Scott switzon creat Development. On Green Tag, we look at

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the top news each week and discuss why it matters

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to industry professionals. And this week we're talking about how

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six Flags stole Christmas. That sounds so mean, Philip sounds well,

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I don't know. I'm sure there's some people that are

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pretty upset about it.

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But well, that's all right, that's all right. We so

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let's start down the long list. You know, the twelve

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days that they took back from Christmas. I yeah, right,

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we're a little bit more than twelve in some parts. Yeah,

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so exactly.

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This was a story that I'm not sure it really

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made national news because it is one of those things

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where six Flags has been canceling events across four parks,

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but different parks, and so I think the reason really

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didn't make national news is because it's spread out, and

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so we're going to.

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Tell me about impact regionally. It was impacting regionally, so

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it didn't make national news. However, this is an I

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guess we can say it international company now, so you

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know you got to kind of look at what the

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small stuff is doing. But I'm sorry I interrupted. Go ahead, and.

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We're going to be excerpting portions from Attractions magazine coverage,

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which pulled everything together and did kind of and did

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reach out for comments. So we're going to be pulling

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excerpts from Blake's work over there. But also, this is

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an article that was sent to both of us by

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multiple people specifically for us, and I think the lens

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for us to talk about it, I like best from

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Martin Pelicky, who sent it from in Park magazine. He

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sent it to me and basically he was asking us

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to discuss it where we always say that doing seasonal

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events and this type of thing is the best practice

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for theme parks. And here is six Flags who just

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talked about all of this great stuff on their investor

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day and now they're doing this and so is this

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going encounter to what we say or is it not

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going to counter? So I think that's a good lens.

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It's great lends. It's a great line.

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As always, Martin has good insight. It's about this items.

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But I'll give details first maybe and we can go

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through each one, but so none of them really said why.

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The only one that really had a quote was from

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Great Adventure, and so at Great Adventure they canceled Holiday

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in the Park and the quote is After much research

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and planning, we've made a strategic decision to focus on

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delivering exceptional guest experiences during our core operating season spring

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through fall. This shift allows us to concentrate our efforts

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and resources during the time when the majority of our

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guests visit Great Adventure, and weather conditions can more consistently

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support our goal to deliver an enjoyable and memorable visit

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for all that's Great Adventure.

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Stop there. We got to break this apart because that

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is the I'm sorry, I'm sorry. No, I don't normally

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get too wound up or too frustrated by this. That

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is so much malarchy that we're just gonna break it

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down sentence by sentence. Now it's the weather, Scott is

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I mean weather. Let's blame everything on the weather, and

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when they don't make their summer numbers, it's gonna be

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the weather's fault. But now it's the weather that the

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why they're getting rid of Christmas.

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So that's what we need we need a we need

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a sound effect. That is, every time a part blames

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something on weather, and we'll do a thunder and a thunderclap.

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I know this is a whole separate thing, and I

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don't want to, you know, but you know, the but

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no horror unleased in Chicago is going to be fine.

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The weather's not going to be an impact at all.

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But weather's impact everybody else. I don't know, Like, yeah,

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but it's it's so so the weather. The weather excuse

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number one. Even more importantly, we really want to focus

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on our core audience and the core times that people

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are there. So before you haven't been. Is that what

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you're saying is that you've been letting the vast majority

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of your operating out. This is shit, you know, really,

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people really think about what you're saying here.

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Yep, And this is one So the reason this is

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so triggering for me is because I have lived through this.

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I have lived through this in my career where it

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looks good on paper to say, let's stop doing these

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extra things, let's cut back on our seasonal activations, and

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what ends up happening is you end up losing money

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and they don't know how to replace it. So what

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you're going to do is you're not going to really

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save that much. What you're going to do is lose

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return visitation. What you're really going to do is lose

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the value of your season pass, all right. So, because

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let's face it, passports, even if it's a separate ticketed event,

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having a passport always gets a discount of some sort, always,

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and so it reduces the value of your season pass,

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all right. So that's an important thing to take into consideration.

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The amount that you're saving looks really good on paper.

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You can reduce your labor looks really good on paper.

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You can not invest in the strike, the storage, the

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reinstallation of your seasonal activation looks really good on paper.

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But what that translates into is fewer visits because guests

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don't come back, especially if you are a regional or

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a local park. Guess just decide, well, gosh, we won't

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normally we go normally we go to the park maybe

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twice over the summer, once for Halloween, once for Christmas.

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And when you say, okay, we're gonna cut Halloween, we're

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gonna cut Christmas. Okay, we'll go to the park twice

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instead of four times. That's fifty percent of your visitation. Now,

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these numbers are anecdotal, they are made up, but I

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have lived through this. I am hoping six flags. What

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this says to me is we're in trouble and we've

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got to make our stockholders really happy, really fast. So

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we're going to do something like get rid of Christmas

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or get rid of Halloween because it looks like a

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really big cut in the books. What's unfortunate is if

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this holds true as it has. Let's see, I've gone

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through this same challenge three times in my career, twice

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as a consultant and once as a actual member of

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a park, and it is going to backfire because what's

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going to end up happening is they will have such

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depending on how popular the Christmas events were, they will

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have such a backlash that they will have no other

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option but to try to bring back something, try to

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salvage some sort of Christmas. And because they weren't planning

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to do it from the get go, they're going to

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have to do it fast. And you know you've heard

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me say it a million times, make it fast, make

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it cheap, make it good. Well, guess what if you

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want it fast? And good. It ain't gonna be cheap

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and it's going to end up costing them more money

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than had they not canceled it to begin with. So

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I'm sorry, Philip, you may continue now.

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Well, something I was going to ask is where's that line?

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Because something we do talk about is.

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Kind of like.

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Knowing, I guess, looking at your assets and utilizing your

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assets and knowing when also to reinvest in, what to

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stop doing, and what to start doing, which is something

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you say all the time. But I think, like, where's

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the line in this? Because the only thing I was

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thinking about this is and again, I probably have more

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of the board mentality, so like Scott has the I'm

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in the entertainment team on the ground and I'm at

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the park because you've lived through it, and I'm more

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of the like executive suite, which is most of my experience.

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And so when I look at this, I could buy

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the argument only because of their operating calendar. If they

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usually close midway through November, they aren't even open until Thanksgiving,

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So how much time would they really have to monetize

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a Christmas holiday in the park experience? Because you're losing, well,

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you're losing, like I mean, all of December. I mean

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if you close halfway through November, which is their normal

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closing time period, is that enough time even to monetize.

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Well, we're not talking about not doing a Christmas event

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that they've never done. We're talking about canceling a Christmas

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event that they have done so and they've already marketed too.

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They've already marketed, they already have that information. They've already

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spent the marketing money. Yeah, they've already spent the marketing money.

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So what this And people will say, yes, but it'll

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be just cheaper not to open the park. Well, if

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your park is in such bad state that the best

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way for you to make money is to close, you

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got other problems. It's not that's true. It's not Christmas.

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And I would talk to you, Philip, as the C

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suite guy, and say, how are you gonna make up

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for the lost of visitation? Yep, because you are. You're

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gonna lose visitation. And there is not a single person

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out there who is gonna find any way to logically

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disagree with that. Oh no, people will come even if

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we don't have a Christmas event. No, they won't. Not

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if you're putting all your focus, as your statement says,

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putting all your focus on the summer and fall when

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the vast majority of your guests are coming. Well that, yes,

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that is true, but Christmas and Halloween is when they

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come back. So if you can survive on one visit

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from your guests per season, great, good choice.

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Well, I'm still trying to puzzle it out because if

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they normally, I don't know when their operating encounter. I

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looked it up and I don't think it's even been

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announced the or their closing data. I couldn't find it.

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But so I'm sure people are listening probably know. But

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my understanding is it closes mid to late November this

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park in particular, So if Halloween runs until November second

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or third, then it's like one or two weeks. So

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I think. So what you're saying is if basically no

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one's going to come during those weeks at all, it's

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going to just completely drop off because there's no reason

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to because there's no Christmas event for them to see.

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And if they had, if they had been able to

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stay open, you would have gotten one extra visit because

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people want to come and see Christmas before everything closes.

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So you're going to just completely those two weeks will

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be completely.

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Dead or whatever. Assuming that if they even open, that's

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the next question, are they even are they planning on

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just you know, like with seasonal parks, quite often they will,

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as you mentioned, they'll do a Halloween event, then close

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for a couple of weeks, reopen a Christmas event, and

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then close for the season. If they're just saying they're

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going to close at the end of their Halloween event,

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then where are they going to replace or where are

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they going to make up all of the attendants they're

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losing during the Christmas event. Now I don't have access

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to this data. So if the data is such that

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they were losing money I mean losing money hemorrhaging money

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on their Christmas event, then perhaps yes it is best

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to just not do it. But I don't think that's

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the case. Yeah, I think, but I don't think that's

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the case.

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Again, playing the sweet C suite role, I can pretty

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clearly see the argument of like that's probably had That

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probably actually was the argument. The probably argument was like

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why should we set up all this Christmas stuff when

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we're not even going to be opened through Christmas at

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this particular part. We should just shut it down and

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reallocate that budget to a different park that is going

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to be open for Christmas, and that way we can

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have a better return at a different property and encourage

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these people to drive to that place, or you know,

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if they really want to do at Christmas, we can

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drive to the near next nearest place and we'll put

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more money into that.

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So are you going to get it? Are you going

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to give them a discount with your season pass if

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they don't have the almighty Grand six Flag season pass? Yeah?

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So are you gonna give them a gas? Moneber?

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I remember what they said in this story, but I

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know in some of the other at some of the

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other parks they were allowing someone to take if they

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had a ticket already for the cancel thing, or if

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they have a season pass and they canceled the event,

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they're allowing them to go to a nearby thing. But

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your point about like then they have to drive and

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00:12:23.840 --> 00:12:25.639
they still have to like pay for cat So it's

233
00:12:25.639 --> 00:12:27.039
not like it's free and family.

234
00:12:27.759 --> 00:12:29.679
Yeah, it's not a one for one swap here.

235
00:12:30.399 --> 00:12:34.080
Yes, yes, that's true. Yeah, so that's interesting. I'm sure

236
00:12:34.120 --> 00:12:36.440
that that kunt of argument. I'm not sure if it

237
00:12:36.519 --> 00:12:38.679
was made who knows, But like, that's the interesting I

238
00:12:38.720 --> 00:12:39.639
can I can tell you.

239
00:12:40.159 --> 00:12:42.519
It just looks really good because all they looked at was, oh,

240
00:12:42.559 --> 00:12:44.200
we can save this money and we can save this

241
00:12:44.480 --> 00:12:47.000
that's exactly gave this money and we can save this money.

242
00:12:47.360 --> 00:12:53.639
And I it sounds the projected revenue. Basically, they looked

243
00:12:53.639 --> 00:12:54.600
at the cost saving.

244
00:12:54.679 --> 00:12:57.000
They looked at the cost savings, did not compare it

245
00:12:57.039 --> 00:13:00.519
with the projected revenue, or maybe they did. And like

246
00:13:00.559 --> 00:13:02.519
I said, their Christmas events are in a bigger hurt

247
00:13:02.559 --> 00:13:05.279
than I would anticipate them. But that's a problem that

248
00:13:05.279 --> 00:13:07.440
they should that's a bigger p that's a much bigger problem.

249
00:13:07.559 --> 00:13:10.039
That's a much bigger problem. Too much bigger problem. So

250
00:13:10.519 --> 00:13:14.759
again I am hoping, I'm hoping that they're looking at

251
00:13:14.799 --> 00:13:18.080
this going, well, this is this is this is the

252
00:13:18.159 --> 00:13:22.000
sacrificial lamb that we're going to throw to make our

253
00:13:22.000 --> 00:13:24.279
books look right for the year. But then they look

254
00:13:24.279 --> 00:13:25.799
at going, oh my god, we got to bring this

255
00:13:25.879 --> 00:13:31.200
back now having made this announcement, and if they intend

256
00:13:31.200 --> 00:13:34.600
to go down this path, my recommendation, based on my experience,

257
00:13:35.879 --> 00:13:40.200
is when you have that moment where guests are saying,

258
00:13:40.240 --> 00:13:44.679
you've ruined my holidays forever. You've made my children. You've

259
00:13:44.759 --> 00:13:49.039
ruined my children's Christmas because we went every year, and

260
00:13:50.039 --> 00:13:51.840
you're going to get at least one of those, if

261
00:13:51.840 --> 00:13:56.279
not hundreds of them. Do not try to bring it

262
00:13:56.320 --> 00:13:58.440
back this year. Bring it back next year with grand

263
00:13:58.480 --> 00:14:02.120
glory and excitement. We love you. Please come back for Christmas,

264
00:14:02.440 --> 00:14:04.919
because if you have to bring it back the same year,

265
00:14:05.080 --> 00:14:07.039
you're gonna spend twice as much and you're gonna get

266
00:14:07.480 --> 00:14:10.440
half the bang for the buck. So you're basically gonna

267
00:14:10.440 --> 00:14:12.799
shoot yourself in the foot twice. Number one for canceling

268
00:14:12.840 --> 00:14:14.960
Christmas and number two for bringing it back in appropriately.

269
00:14:16.399 --> 00:14:19.799
The idea here is, and again I'm not saying this

270
00:14:20.039 --> 00:14:24.000
just because as a consultant, I do holiday I do

271
00:14:24.080 --> 00:14:27.639
seasonal activations. I'm not saying it because of that. I

272
00:14:27.720 --> 00:14:33.080
have seen it work significantly more times than it not work.

273
00:14:33.639 --> 00:14:37.639
And if you know, I like to think about it

274
00:14:37.679 --> 00:14:39.759
as you're throwing the baby out with the bathwater here.

275
00:14:40.320 --> 00:14:43.080
If you've got a Christmas event that is not is

276
00:14:43.120 --> 00:14:46.519
not turning a profit, because again, the only way this

277
00:14:46.679 --> 00:14:52.519
actually saves money is if the event itself is not profitable.

278
00:14:53.240 --> 00:14:56.519
Yep, And which is the problem if you can't make

279
00:14:56.519 --> 00:14:58.399
money off Christmas, there's there's a bigger problem.

280
00:14:58.399 --> 00:14:59.799
There's a much bigger problem. Yeah.

281
00:15:00.279 --> 00:15:03.360
So your argument is even if it's early, because I

282
00:15:03.360 --> 00:15:05.679
don't even know when people start, you know, that's the thing.

283
00:15:05.879 --> 00:15:08.720
I think people start celebrating Christmas pretty early, so I

284
00:15:08.759 --> 00:15:11.759
think it would still yeah, yeah, exactly.

285
00:15:12.840 --> 00:15:15.960
Most most Christmas events that I work on in the

286
00:15:16.000 --> 00:15:20.120
smaller the smaller parks start maybe the week before Thanksgiving

287
00:15:20.919 --> 00:15:22.240
because it gives them a little bit of time to

288
00:15:22.320 --> 00:15:26.679
change over from Halloween. But you know, look at look

289
00:15:26.720 --> 00:15:29.600
at Disney, they have two night starts. They have a

290
00:15:29.600 --> 00:15:30.919
two night changeover. Yeah.

291
00:15:31.000 --> 00:15:33.559
Yeah, they start like I think November eighth this year's Yeah,

292
00:15:33.720 --> 00:15:38.120
well so looking let's look at some of the there's

293
00:15:38.159 --> 00:15:40.240
three other parks that are doing different and they're all

294
00:15:40.240 --> 00:15:45.919
different reasons. So six Flags over Georgia. It also cancels

295
00:15:45.960 --> 00:15:49.039
Holiday in the Park. And this is a little bit

296
00:15:49.039 --> 00:15:53.960
different because it's actually going to continue operating through November thirtieth,

297
00:15:54.000 --> 00:15:56.519
so this is going through Thanksgiving, but they're still canceling

298
00:15:56.720 --> 00:15:58.759
Holiday in the Park and instead what they're going to

299
00:15:58.840 --> 00:16:02.159
do is a debut a new event called Heroes Fest

300
00:16:02.480 --> 00:16:05.720
starting November ninth, and they said, it's a celebration of

301
00:16:05.759 --> 00:16:09.399
your favorite heroes alongside everyday heroes in our local community.

302
00:16:10.960 --> 00:16:15.799
So this is like I feel like it's almost worse

303
00:16:16.000 --> 00:16:17.320
in a way because like they're not it's not like

304
00:16:17.360 --> 00:16:21.720
they're not doing anything. They're like, we're gonna do a event,

305
00:16:21.840 --> 00:16:23.519
but it's going to be this and the event isn't

306
00:16:23.559 --> 00:16:26.200
even going to start until November ninth, so like it's

307
00:16:26.240 --> 00:16:29.240
only going to be a several week event anyway, but

308
00:16:29.320 --> 00:16:31.559
it's not Holidays in the Park, which already has brand

309
00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:32.840
recognition and all.

310
00:16:32.759 --> 00:16:35.039
The things you just said. And it's also.

311
00:16:36.440 --> 00:16:39.559
Like not going to start right after Halloween, so you're

312
00:16:39.600 --> 00:16:43.000
still missing that like between the days of whatever they

313
00:16:43.039 --> 00:16:44.720
in hallowbeing November two and the ninth.

314
00:16:44.720 --> 00:16:47.960
That week, no one's gonna go so like what somebody

315
00:16:48.000 --> 00:16:49.919
went to Gaylord and said, Hey, look they're having great

316
00:16:50.000 --> 00:16:53.879
luck with superheroes, let's do that. Uh no. I So

317
00:16:54.000 --> 00:16:58.960
with this one, maybe that is what happened. Crazier things,

318
00:16:59.080 --> 00:17:04.519
you know, goof for your things happen sometimes with this one, again,

319
00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:09.079
I think it is I think it is misguided, but

320
00:17:10.440 --> 00:17:13.359
at the very least they're not getting rid of a

321
00:17:13.400 --> 00:17:19.680
seasonal activation, they're replacing one with another, now does it?

322
00:17:20.039 --> 00:17:23.000
Lad they do it when they've already marketed an announced

323
00:17:23.000 --> 00:17:25.359
holiday in the park, Like why, Like again, why wouldn't

324
00:17:25.400 --> 00:17:28.480
you I guess because of the merger and they didn't

325
00:17:28.519 --> 00:17:30.440
have the time, I guess to do it, But like,

326
00:17:30.480 --> 00:17:32.960
what wouldn't you think wouldn't you think the way to

327
00:17:32.960 --> 00:17:35.359
do it would be this year? Just do the holiday

328
00:17:35.400 --> 00:17:37.880
in the park and then say next year we're going

329
00:17:37.960 --> 00:17:42.200
to have this event instead, instead of like marketing a

330
00:17:42.240 --> 00:17:44.359
thing and then canceling it and then doing a new thing,

331
00:17:44.400 --> 00:17:46.519
which now you have less time to market, Like what,

332
00:17:46.759 --> 00:17:49.079
why would you have done it this way instead of

333
00:17:49.119 --> 00:17:50.000
waiting until next year?

334
00:17:50.039 --> 00:17:51.640
Well, the only thing I can think of is because

335
00:17:51.640 --> 00:17:53.799
now they're only going to be opened through November thirtieth.

336
00:17:54.200 --> 00:17:55.720
I would have imagined if they were going to do

337
00:17:55.759 --> 00:17:58.079
holidays in the park, they would have been opened through

338
00:17:58.200 --> 00:18:02.279
Christmas week or through you know, January first. So it's

339
00:18:02.359 --> 00:18:08.400
trimming operations, trimming an operations calendar, which means thirty days

340
00:18:08.480 --> 00:18:10.920
less of earning revenue. Yeah.

341
00:18:11.720 --> 00:18:16.680
Right, So that's something interesting because I keep thinking about

342
00:18:17.160 --> 00:18:19.759
does this track with what they had said during the

343
00:18:19.799 --> 00:18:22.720
investor day? And I want to say, it kind of

344
00:18:22.759 --> 00:18:26.440
does track because they did mention an investor day about

345
00:18:26.440 --> 00:18:31.640
how they were going to be optimizing the operations calendars,

346
00:18:32.119 --> 00:18:34.519
and so I think maybe we didn't interpret it in

347
00:18:34.559 --> 00:18:38.000
this way, but you could look at this as optimizing.

348
00:18:38.279 --> 00:18:40.200
I mean, whether or not to your point, whether or

349
00:18:40.200 --> 00:18:44.960
not they're correctly calculating the lost revenue or they're just

350
00:18:45.000 --> 00:18:48.920
looking at costs, that's a different question. But like basically

351
00:18:48.920 --> 00:18:51.640
they're saying this, these parts are not worth operating in

352
00:18:51.680 --> 00:18:53.720
these weeks. And so because these are not operating in

353
00:18:53.720 --> 00:18:56.720
these weeks, we're not going to put the holiday events

354
00:18:56.720 --> 00:18:57.400
on them.

355
00:18:58.480 --> 00:19:02.559
Yeah, and the idea of you know, getting the most

356
00:19:02.559 --> 00:19:05.240
clicks of the turnstile, which is something else they were

357
00:19:05.599 --> 00:19:10.319
very adamant about. They're going to expect those without providing

358
00:19:10.359 --> 00:19:14.359
anything new or unique to bring people back, right not.

359
00:19:14.440 --> 00:19:17.519
I think that's that's the fallacy in all of it. Yeah,

360
00:19:17.599 --> 00:19:19.680
that's definitely. And also I think you make a good

361
00:19:19.680 --> 00:19:23.079
point where it's like you would think that if they

362
00:19:23.119 --> 00:19:25.480
were going to ever make money at any point, it's going

363
00:19:25.519 --> 00:19:26.759
to be during Christmas.

364
00:19:26.960 --> 00:19:30.039
Well, Like, again, each of these regional parks has their

365
00:19:30.079 --> 00:19:33.640
own unique challenges, their own unique competitions, et cetera, et cetera,

366
00:19:33.640 --> 00:19:37.720
et cetera. It is possible. It is possible that six

367
00:19:37.960 --> 00:19:39.400
See now I sound more like me because I'm being

368
00:19:39.440 --> 00:19:42.400
a little more Switzerland here, but it is possible that

369
00:19:42.440 --> 00:19:46.319
with six Flags over Georgia. The reason they're not doing

370
00:19:46.359 --> 00:19:49.279
a Christmas event is because they can't compete with all

371
00:19:49.319 --> 00:19:53.119
of the other local Christmas events. There's already you know,

372
00:19:53.200 --> 00:19:55.880
stuff around them. I don't know what their competition would be,

373
00:19:55.920 --> 00:19:59.559
but there's already enough stuff around them that people are

374
00:19:59.599 --> 00:20:02.839
all committed to that they figure, well, gosh, we don't

375
00:20:02.839 --> 00:20:05.039
really need it, but let's do let's do at least

376
00:20:05.039 --> 00:20:09.519
something heartfelt, which is superheroes. But I'm not quite sure

377
00:20:10.720 --> 00:20:14.200
hero Fest it's a celebration of our favorite heroes alongside

378
00:20:14.519 --> 00:20:20.759
everyday heroes in our local community. Are these IP heroes?

379
00:20:20.880 --> 00:20:24.279
Are these made up heroes? I think it's both.

380
00:20:24.559 --> 00:20:27.920
It's like it's like the local teacher, but also with

381
00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:28.559
like Superman.

382
00:20:28.720 --> 00:20:30.640
Right, Well, I mean I know that they have I

383
00:20:30.680 --> 00:20:35.920
know that they have that the Six Flags has IP

384
00:20:36.160 --> 00:20:43.200
relations with you know, Batman, Flash, Yeah, DC DC generally speaking.

385
00:20:43.279 --> 00:20:49.519
Yeah, Well, I wonder if it's it could be a

386
00:20:49.519 --> 00:20:51.680
competition thing. I you know, you're right at the could

387
00:20:51.720 --> 00:20:53.920
be competition, But then it goes back to the idea

388
00:20:53.960 --> 00:20:56.240
of value of the season past, which you mentioned earlier,

389
00:20:56.359 --> 00:20:59.279
like if it's free, I mean, the thing about the

390
00:20:59.279 --> 00:21:01.079
competition is that they have to pay to go to

391
00:21:01.119 --> 00:21:04.519
any other event. But in theory, if you're going based

392
00:21:04.519 --> 00:21:06.759
off of the theory of the just the turnstile clicking,

393
00:21:07.160 --> 00:21:08.839
it should be free to go to holiday in the park.

394
00:21:08.920 --> 00:21:11.200
So again it's a value add where like you just

395
00:21:11.319 --> 00:21:14.200
get an extra event for the past, were already.

396
00:21:13.920 --> 00:21:16.400
Paid, no reason, now you don't get back. Yeah, another

397
00:21:16.440 --> 00:21:18.240
reason for people to come back, but at least they're

398
00:21:18.279 --> 00:21:19.359
replacing it with something.

399
00:21:20.200 --> 00:21:23.960
Yeah, so someone who's not replacing anything. So let's go

400
00:21:24.000 --> 00:21:29.720
to Michigan's Adventure. At Michigan Adventure, the family friendly Tricks

401
00:21:29.720 --> 00:21:32.599
and Treats event is canceled for twenty twenty five, and

402
00:21:33.039 --> 00:21:36.440
it will shorten its operating season as well entirely. The

403
00:21:36.480 --> 00:21:38.720
final day of its twenty twenty five calendar is now

404
00:21:38.759 --> 00:21:43.759
September first, So I think this one is more Again,

405
00:21:43.839 --> 00:21:46.839
it's a smaller part. I mean again, it's a really small,

406
00:21:46.920 --> 00:21:49.720
smaller regional park. So this really could just be that.

407
00:21:49.799 --> 00:21:52.480
This is the pendulum swinging back. This is the pendulum

408
00:21:52.519 --> 00:21:59.200
swinging back, and Michigan Muskegan by September first, it's pretty cold, yep,

409
00:21:59.359 --> 00:22:05.240
pretty chill, so this could be weather related. The interesting

410
00:22:05.279 --> 00:22:10.279
thing to me is it's the tricks and treats event

411
00:22:10.480 --> 00:22:14.960
that is canceled. Yeah, it's it's the lighthearted, family friendly

412
00:22:15.000 --> 00:22:16.920
event that every park thinks they want to do for

413
00:22:16.960 --> 00:22:23.359
Halloween that is canceled, so once again shortening their operating calendar,

414
00:22:24.279 --> 00:22:29.400
shortening their opportunity to earn money, and eliminating something that

415
00:22:30.720 --> 00:22:34.039
would bring people back, especially people with young children. Now

416
00:22:35.039 --> 00:22:39.480
there is there are many different schools of thought on

417
00:22:39.680 --> 00:22:43.039
how do you handle your target audience. Do you do

418
00:22:43.079 --> 00:22:45.240
you aim at your low target for Christmas and your

419
00:22:45.279 --> 00:22:49.960
families for I'm sorry, and your older target for Halloween

420
00:22:50.119 --> 00:22:51.599
or do you flip flop that or do you do

421
00:22:51.640 --> 00:22:54.920
them all? And there's a gazillion different reasons to do it,

422
00:22:54.960 --> 00:22:58.920
a gazillion different ways. So that's that's just depends on

423
00:22:58.960 --> 00:23:03.000
the park with this one. It's what I'm seeing here,

424
00:23:03.039 --> 00:23:05.640
and maybe I'm wrong, but what I'm seeing here is

425
00:23:06.880 --> 00:23:08.400
we have to make a radical cut. The only thing

426
00:23:08.480 --> 00:23:11.839
we can do is shorten our season, and we can't

427
00:23:11.839 --> 00:23:16.079
do trick or treat before September first. So really, what

428
00:23:16.119 --> 00:23:18.039
they're doing here is this is not a canceling of

429
00:23:18.079 --> 00:23:21.039
a seasonal event. This is a shortening of the park

430
00:23:21.079 --> 00:23:26.119
operating calendar. Yep, yep, because something, something is so far

431
00:23:26.200 --> 00:23:33.240
amiss that they've got to find a way to fix

432
00:23:33.480 --> 00:23:37.160
some sort of financial leak they have going on. That's

433
00:23:37.200 --> 00:23:39.640
what this seems like to me. Now maybe I'm wrong.

434
00:23:39.680 --> 00:23:41.240
I don't sit on their board, so.

435
00:23:43.160 --> 00:23:46.480
Yeah, it's and plus, I would say it looks like

436
00:23:46.519 --> 00:23:48.720
it's a pretty small I was trying to find numbers

437
00:23:48.759 --> 00:23:54.200
for when they when they There are no published numbers

438
00:23:54.240 --> 00:23:57.519
that I could find easily, but in eleven, twenty eleven

439
00:23:57.559 --> 00:24:00.920
and a million attendance annually, But that was twenty eleven.

440
00:24:00.960 --> 00:24:01.920
Then we've had like ups and down.

441
00:24:01.960 --> 00:24:06.599
Oh yeah, so yeah, it's not a huge park. Right.

442
00:24:06.680 --> 00:24:10.680
So well, not only not only are they shortening their

443
00:24:10.720 --> 00:24:16.240
calendars or getting rid of seasonal activations, aren't they also

444
00:24:16.559 --> 00:24:18.279
changing their There's one we didn't talk about. Oh there's

445
00:24:18.279 --> 00:24:19.000
one we didn't talk about.

446
00:24:19.000 --> 00:24:20.680
Okay, yes there's one, And I said it for the

447
00:24:20.759 --> 00:24:22.440
end because I think this one is the one that

448
00:24:22.480 --> 00:24:26.279
has the most uh, makes the most sense. So in

449
00:24:26.400 --> 00:24:29.000
six Lags of America, Okay, so remember six Lags America

450
00:24:29.039 --> 00:24:31.480
is the one that is like permanently closing. Okay, so

451
00:24:32.039 --> 00:24:34.279
this one is six Lags America is permanently closing. At

452
00:24:34.319 --> 00:24:36.599
the conclusion, there was twenty twenty five season and what

453
00:24:36.640 --> 00:24:39.960
they said was they're canceling Fright Fast for this So

454
00:24:40.480 --> 00:24:42.720
FrightFest was supposed to be the last thing to ever

455
00:24:42.759 --> 00:24:46.400
happen at the park, and it's closing permanently on November

456
00:24:46.400 --> 00:24:52.240
twod So basically it's just done, like there's going to

457
00:24:52.279 --> 00:24:54.400
be no Fright Fast, no event, no anything. So but

458
00:24:54.480 --> 00:24:56.880
I think I can see it on one end, like

459
00:24:56.920 --> 00:25:01.119
this park is closing. So what I would say, if

460
00:25:01.119 --> 00:25:06.200
we're looking back our previous conversation, the board is probably

461
00:25:06.200 --> 00:25:09.480
thinking this is closing anyway permanently, so why would we

462
00:25:09.559 --> 00:25:12.799
spend money on Freightfast. But then I think Scott's point

463
00:25:12.920 --> 00:25:16.240
is like, then why would anybody come to your park

464
00:25:16.400 --> 00:25:17.279
before it closes.

465
00:25:18.079 --> 00:25:22.200
Well, they may be opting on they may be relying

466
00:25:22.240 --> 00:25:24.519
on the fact that there's a nostalgia that we well,

467
00:25:24.519 --> 00:25:26.319
we've got to go before it closes, and they're not

468
00:25:26.359 --> 00:25:29.680
they don't need their Halloween event to do that. It'll

469
00:25:29.720 --> 00:25:31.640
be oh, it'll be our last chance to do this,

470
00:25:31.759 --> 00:25:33.799
It'll be our last chance to do I mean, look

471
00:25:33.799 --> 00:25:37.480
at at Walt Disney World. Here the people the attendance

472
00:25:37.480 --> 00:25:40.039
at Magic Kingdom for the last day of riding the

473
00:25:40.920 --> 00:25:44.039
paddle boat, you know, before that closed to become cars.

474
00:25:45.640 --> 00:25:47.839
So they they may be playing on the nostalgia. To me,

475
00:25:48.160 --> 00:25:51.119
it's short timers. They they're just looking at it going, well,

476
00:25:51.160 --> 00:25:53.559
we're closing anyway, why should we Why should we bust

477
00:25:53.559 --> 00:25:56.480
our butt to do this. Let's let's just you know,

478
00:25:56.640 --> 00:25:59.279
not do it. Plus, I think staffing would be a challenge,

479
00:26:00.240 --> 00:26:02.720
that's true. There's no longevity, you know, the parks going away,

480
00:26:03.240 --> 00:26:08.160
so I don't know how they would staff the I

481
00:26:08.200 --> 00:26:10.480
get the additional staff they would need to do Fright Fest.

482
00:26:11.720 --> 00:26:13.319
So this one you think makes the most sense. This

483
00:26:13.359 --> 00:26:15.240
one does need to make the most sense because the

484
00:26:15.279 --> 00:26:18.799
park's closing. All they're really doing and permanently, So all

485
00:26:18.839 --> 00:26:20.079
they're really doing is closing early.

486
00:26:21.000 --> 00:26:25.119
Yeah yeah, so then they're not they're not losing any

487
00:26:25.240 --> 00:26:27.799
like ip thing with the other parts because you're not

488
00:26:27.839 --> 00:26:29.000
going to reopen pfast there.

489
00:26:29.039 --> 00:26:31.720
Yeah, they're they're they're closing early, and in that case

490
00:26:31.720 --> 00:26:34.480
it may it may actually save them money. But speaking

491
00:26:34.519 --> 00:26:37.519
of saving money, if you are a fan of Six Flags,

492
00:26:38.359 --> 00:26:40.160
aren't they adjusting their ticketing as well?

493
00:26:41.359 --> 00:26:44.480
So they're running a sale right now also, which is

494
00:26:44.519 --> 00:26:46.599
interesting that these are done at the same time. And

495
00:26:46.680 --> 00:26:49.920
I feel like it's an interesting push where you have

496
00:26:50.000 --> 00:26:53.279
these parks where they're only in these three instances right

497
00:26:53.319 --> 00:26:57.400
but in these three instances you're losing perceived value because

498
00:26:57.759 --> 00:26:59.880
of the season passes, because of the canceled events. How

499
00:27:02.000 --> 00:27:04.920
they are doing a new promotion right now. They finally

500
00:27:04.960 --> 00:27:07.799
put on sale the most valuable pass, which is the

501
00:27:07.839 --> 00:27:11.400
one that includes all of the parks, So it's on sale.

502
00:27:11.480 --> 00:27:14.680
It's a special sale that's happening right now through September first,

503
00:27:15.079 --> 00:27:17.960
and during this time, anyone who purchases a Gold or

504
00:27:18.000 --> 00:27:23.720
Prestige Tier twenty twenty six pass will get admission to

505
00:27:24.160 --> 00:27:27.240
your park that you get your your main park. You'll

506
00:27:27.240 --> 00:27:29.640
get that admission for the rest of this year and

507
00:27:29.759 --> 00:27:33.880
for next year and all other Six Flags own parks four,

508
00:27:34.000 --> 00:27:36.960
twenty twenty five, and twenty twenty six. Plus we'll get

509
00:27:36.960 --> 00:27:39.440
a bring a Friend ticket to use in twenty twenty five,

510
00:27:40.119 --> 00:27:43.279
one for Gold and two for Prestige, and most of

511
00:27:43.319 --> 00:27:47.880
them also include parking. So the prices range because you

512
00:27:47.880 --> 00:27:49.920
do have to have a home park, so the prices

513
00:27:50.039 --> 00:27:52.359
range from like roughly seventy to one hundred and twenty.

514
00:27:52.599 --> 00:27:54.240
A NAS is like one hundred and twenty for that

515
00:27:55.079 --> 00:27:55.759
for that.

516
00:27:55.960 --> 00:27:59.079
But so that's basically and I'm thinking about it at Notts,

517
00:27:59.079 --> 00:28:01.240
I'm like, well, one hundred and twenty if it includes

518
00:28:01.640 --> 00:28:03.559
parking and gets you like a bring a friend deal

519
00:28:03.839 --> 00:28:06.200
and includes all of the rest of twenty twenty five

520
00:28:06.279 --> 00:28:10.359
and all twenty twenty six. I mean, that's like, that's.

521
00:28:10.160 --> 00:28:11.519
I'm thinking about it, and I don't even have a

522
00:28:11.519 --> 00:28:16.200
local Knots park. Yeah, I mean a perfect example when

523
00:28:17.119 --> 00:28:21.119
when Eric and I went to Great America, we bought

524
00:28:21.119 --> 00:28:24.400
a season pass because we bought a season pass during

525
00:28:24.400 --> 00:28:26.680
one of these sales. It was during one of these sales,

526
00:28:27.160 --> 00:28:31.720
and the season pass was the price of a single admission. Yeah,

527
00:28:32.279 --> 00:28:34.720
and we were going to be there two days, so

528
00:28:34.759 --> 00:28:36.759
we bought a season pass and didn't pay for parking.

529
00:28:38.599 --> 00:28:42.200
And it's crazy. So yeah, let me let me just

530
00:28:42.240 --> 00:28:45.640
point this out. If you have a pair of genes

531
00:28:45.640 --> 00:28:48.400
that cost one hundred dollars and you mark them down

532
00:28:48.400 --> 00:28:51.359
to ten dollars, They're no longer one hundred dollars pair

533
00:28:51.359 --> 00:28:52.960
of jeens. They are now a ten dollars pair of

534
00:28:53.039 --> 00:28:56.359
jeens that you're going to overcharge for later exactly so,

535
00:28:57.119 --> 00:29:00.839
and again this is based on personal experience. I have

536
00:29:01.039 --> 00:29:03.720
seen parks that have decided we just need to click

537
00:29:03.720 --> 00:29:06.640
the turnstiles. We'll make all that money back in food

538
00:29:06.680 --> 00:29:10.880
and beverage and in revenue and or in merchandise revenue

539
00:29:10.960 --> 00:29:18.000
and you know, upsell and alat of it. It has

540
00:29:19.319 --> 00:29:21.599
it has taken some parks a very long time to

541
00:29:21.640 --> 00:29:27.480
recover from this. This is this is devaluing the park.

542
00:29:29.240 --> 00:29:32.200
I mean, just by definition, they're saying that it is

543
00:29:32.519 --> 00:29:36.240
it is worth our parks are only worth seventy five

544
00:29:36.279 --> 00:29:41.200
dollars for full and complete admission every single day for

545
00:29:41.279 --> 00:29:44.119
like two years, two years, even less for two years,

546
00:29:44.720 --> 00:29:48.119
so I mean, and even at one hundred and twenty, yeah,

547
00:29:48.160 --> 00:29:49.480
you know, even at one hundred and twenty.

548
00:29:50.400 --> 00:29:53.160
Yeah, that's I think that's the biggest problem with this

549
00:29:53.200 --> 00:29:54.720
is something I'm not sure we've talked to much about

550
00:29:54.720 --> 00:29:57.079
the show, but it's the whole discount strategy.

551
00:29:57.559 --> 00:29:57.799
I know.

552
00:29:57.880 --> 00:29:59.599
I used to talk about this whenever I teach a

553
00:29:59.640 --> 00:30:03.759
marketing even with Haunters. You're like, everybody always wants to

554
00:30:03.759 --> 00:30:06.000
be like, let's do a discount ticket, and I'm like,

555
00:30:06.279 --> 00:30:10.160
do not do that, because then, like even if you

556
00:30:10.400 --> 00:30:13.359
if any if it comes from a point of good things,

557
00:30:13.359 --> 00:30:15.119
So like say you want to do a discount for

558
00:30:15.200 --> 00:30:20.079
your military members or your local high school or you know,

559
00:30:20.279 --> 00:30:22.640
I mean, there's so many good causes, and I'm like,

560
00:30:22.759 --> 00:30:26.400
I appreciate that sentiment, channel that sentiment into giving them

561
00:30:27.119 --> 00:30:30.720
more value, to treat them more special because of that.

562
00:30:31.079 --> 00:30:33.519
So find a way to say, if you're a service member,

563
00:30:33.519 --> 00:30:36.200
then we're going to actually give you a free fast

564
00:30:36.200 --> 00:30:40.640
pass instead and make it added value. Always add value,

565
00:30:40.839 --> 00:30:44.920
never take value away. And then or even for service members,

566
00:30:45.599 --> 00:30:48.119
for every ticket sold, you can bring a family member

567
00:30:48.160 --> 00:30:52.319
for free. Oh see that's even see do that instead,

568
00:30:52.519 --> 00:30:54.519
Like this is this is one of those things where

569
00:30:54.519 --> 00:30:57.279
you're like, I know you want to encourage it's supplied demand.

570
00:30:57.559 --> 00:31:00.240
I know, we know you want to encourage the ticket

571
00:31:00.680 --> 00:31:04.000
turnstiles and all that that Scott said. However, I do

572
00:31:04.119 --> 00:31:05.720
also agree this is the wrong way to do it,

573
00:31:05.759 --> 00:31:08.039
because all you're doing is devaluing the long term value

574
00:31:08.119 --> 00:31:10.759
of the parks, because what's gonna happen in a few

575
00:31:10.799 --> 00:31:13.599
years when you've spent all this money renovating and then

576
00:31:13.720 --> 00:31:16.279
you're gonna say it's worth more because of all the renovations.

577
00:31:16.440 --> 00:31:18.519
But everyone else is not going to agree, right, And

578
00:31:18.759 --> 00:31:21.200
I'll go so far as to say, I've taken what

579
00:31:21.240 --> 00:31:25.240
I've learned from what I will call failed pricing structures

580
00:31:25.960 --> 00:31:29.720
in other parks, and yes that is plural, in other parks.

581
00:31:30.000 --> 00:31:32.640
I've taken what I've learned from there and actually applied

582
00:31:32.640 --> 00:31:35.680
it to my own pricing structure for my consultation fees.

583
00:31:36.160 --> 00:31:39.279
I will not I do have different tiers based on

584
00:31:39.319 --> 00:31:43.599
what the organization is, because that's matching the level of

585
00:31:45.319 --> 00:31:49.000
it's meeting my clients where they live. Okay, But I

586
00:31:49.079 --> 00:31:51.799
will not change the price of something. I may discount

587
00:31:51.839 --> 00:31:54.920
it if they book more things like I will do

588
00:31:54.960 --> 00:31:56.720
a quote that will say this is then I will

589
00:31:56.720 --> 00:31:58.599
on top of this, I'll give you a twenty percent

590
00:31:58.640 --> 00:32:01.559
package discount if all of these if you sign a

591
00:32:01.559 --> 00:32:03.799
contract for all these things, the moment they decide to

592
00:32:03.799 --> 00:32:07.599
break that up, that twenty percent discount goes away. So

593
00:32:07.960 --> 00:32:11.799
it is as you say it is a value add

594
00:32:12.119 --> 00:32:15.680
not a my services are worthless. And the moment you

595
00:32:15.720 --> 00:32:19.079
say your park is worthless, it takes you years and

596
00:32:19.279 --> 00:32:24.440
years and years to recover from that. So I'm hoping

597
00:32:24.559 --> 00:32:29.880
that this sale doesn't become a permanent sale. I'm hoping

598
00:32:29.960 --> 00:32:31.680
that they can get because the reason you do sales

599
00:32:31.720 --> 00:32:34.319
like this is because you are cash poor. You need

600
00:32:34.359 --> 00:32:38.440
an influx. You need an influx of money. Now, so

601
00:32:39.039 --> 00:32:41.279
you decide, well, let's kick the can down the road

602
00:32:41.319 --> 00:32:43.799
a little bit. But what's going to happen? And I

603
00:32:43.880 --> 00:32:47.559
have seen it happen before. You get a seventy five

604
00:32:47.599 --> 00:32:52.400
dollars two year pass, it expires, and you're trying to

605
00:32:52.480 --> 00:32:55.119
charge full price again, you know, three hundred and fifty dollars,

606
00:32:56.519 --> 00:32:58.559
and all of a sudden they're like, well it was

607
00:32:58.720 --> 00:33:01.799
seventy five two years ago. What I'm not going to

608
00:33:01.880 --> 00:33:05.759
do that. Let's go somewhere else. It will happen. It

609
00:33:05.799 --> 00:33:09.440
will happen. So I'm hoping that they've got a great strategy.

610
00:33:10.160 --> 00:33:12.359
I have to say, and you may not hear it,

611
00:33:12.640 --> 00:33:15.319
I actually thoroughly enjoy six Flags Parks. If it weren't

612
00:33:15.359 --> 00:33:18.200
for six Flags Great America, I would not be a

613
00:33:18.200 --> 00:33:20.599
theme park nerd. I grew up in those parks. I

614
00:33:20.720 --> 00:33:22.960
just recently went back to those parks and Six Flags

615
00:33:23.000 --> 00:33:28.279
looked great, by the way, really clean, not terribly well attended,

616
00:33:28.640 --> 00:33:34.319
but but everything was working, everything was running, The park

617
00:33:34.440 --> 00:33:40.720
was immaculate, the the staff was okay, they're pretty good.

618
00:33:41.039 --> 00:33:43.880
So I love Six Flags parks. I just hope you're

619
00:33:43.920 --> 00:33:47.279
not making a big mistake, that's all. So we're at

620
00:33:47.319 --> 00:33:48.839
a time speaking of a big mistake. We've gone on.

621
00:33:49.680 --> 00:33:53.400
We're way over time. So again it hit a trigger

622
00:33:53.400 --> 00:33:55.880
with me. So I apologize folks, and thank you everyone

623
00:33:55.880 --> 00:33:58.079
for sending this to us. Yeah, we appreciate. Yes, you

624
00:33:58.119 --> 00:34:00.440
knew it would trigger me. You knew it would trigger me,

625
00:34:00.480 --> 00:34:03.640
so you were right. This is Green Tag Theme Parking

626
00:34:03.720 --> 00:34:07.359
thirty and on behalf of Philip Heernandez and myself Scott Swinson.

627
00:34:07.839 --> 00:34:08.679
We'll see you next week.
Scott Swenson, ICAE Profile Photo
Scott Swenson, ICAE

For over 30 years, Scott Swenson has been bringing stories to life as a writer, director, producer, and performer. His work in theme parks, consumer events, live theatre, and television has given him a broad spectrum of experiences. In 2014, after 21 years with SeaWorld Parks and Entertainment, Scott formed Scott Swenson Creative Development. Since then he has been providing impactful experiences for clients around the world. Whether he is installing shows on cruise ships or creating seasonal festivals for theme parks, writing educational presentations for zoos and museums or training the next generation of attractions professionals, Scott is always finding new ways to tell stories that engage, educate and entertain.

Philip Hernandez, ICAE Profile Photo
Philip Hernandez, ICAE

CEO of Gantom, Publisher of Haunted Attraction Network

Philip is a journalist reporting on the Haunted House Industry, Horror events, Theme Parks, and Halloween. He is also the CEO of Gantom Lighting and Founder / Publisher of the Haunted Attraction Network, the haunted attraction industry's most prominent news media source. He is based in Los Angeles.