Dec. 1, 2024

Theme Park Growth in China, Luxury Resorts in Mexico, and Mattel Adventure Delays

China was poised to become the new theme park capital of the world before the pandemic closed its tourism; new numbers show the sector is finally recovering. Will we see China resurface as a major tourism investor?

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Philip and Scott dive into key developments in the global attractions industry. China's theme parks are seeing a massive rebound, with a 71.8% surge in visitors and nearly 98% revenue growth in 2023. Meanwhile, Mexico's Grupo Vidanta revealed groundbreaking details for VidantaWorld’s BON Luxury Theme Park, a $1.3 billion project opening in 2026. Finally, the Mattel Adventure Park opening has been delayed until 2025, reflecting ongoing challenges in the industry, from supply chain disruptions to economic uncertainty.

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Show Notes:

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From our studios this week in Los Angeles and Tampa.

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This is Green Tag Theme Park and thirty. I'm Philip

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and I'm joined as always by my delightful co host

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Scott Swinson of Scott Swinson Creative Development and Uh. This week,

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Scott with we should talk a little bit about the

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rebounding I think of the industry in other places.

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Yeah.

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So we've talked a lot about how it's rebounding in

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the US, and we talked a lot last week about

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how Ayappa was setting new records and what's happening in

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the rest of the world.

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Philip, Yeah, well physically.

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Let's see.

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So we heard we got research out this week from

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China and it looks very exciting. So this came out

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from the China Daily and it's a it's their tourism

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department put together a little study and they just kind

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of gave us the highlights of the study, and it

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says that the China's theme park industry experienced significant growth

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in twenty twenty three, with one hundred and thirty million

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visitors total, marking a seventy one point eight percent increase

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in visitors and a ninety seven increase in revenue from

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the previous year, So this is twenty twenty three numbers,

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and we're looking at the previous year. As of October

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twenty twenty four, sixty percent of China's three hundred and

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eighty five theme parks were profitable, reflecting the sector's robust expansion.

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And so this is a little bit of a time delay.

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And of course, so you're looking at these numbers from

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the closure. So I think I'm interpreting this as we've

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talked about before. Whereas the US, since we grew open

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so early, we're at we're past that like post pandemic

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surge in travel demand. But other areas that opened later,

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like China opened I think pretty late that towards some

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sector open pretty late comparatively to the rest of world,

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so they're earlier in the cycle of reopening and they

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should be still having revenge travel and then equalizing and

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whatever whatever, and so hopefully that'll spark new expansion, which

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is what happened here in the US, because if you

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look at the US right, a lot of our stuff

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is opening in twenty twenty six, you know, twenty twenty

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five and twenty twenty six, twenty six seven, with the

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epic next year, and then a few projects Disney has

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announced for the next following years. So I think it

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all kind of follows that timeline. So hopefully we should

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see some new announcements and new reinvestment in China in

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you know, in the next few years. And I wanted

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to mention this is something that was mirrored in the

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APAC breakfast that they had at Ayapa where we had

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a speaker from Village Road Show and Village Road Show,

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you know, it does a lot of different they have

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them entertainment venues, but they also do shows, and they

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mentioned anecdotally that their events were seeing double digit increases,

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much in line with this report. And they didn't really

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talk about new projects per se, but they'd talk about

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how it was rebounding and then people were recouping. And

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so this is I think exciting for all of us

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because China was supposed to be, you know, the Asia

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region was supposed to be the new Orlando, and then

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it moved over to the OAE, you know, and the OE,

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I think, has opened up new parks and is announced

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more plans and has opened up faster, right, And so

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this then the pandemic kind of really choked that Chinese economy,

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and I think now we're hoping that as the economy

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recovers and that reopens, and then travel spending and stimulus

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and all that will help bring new projects there and

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maybe potentially in time for when the projects are already opened,

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because once EPIC opens, that a lot of people who

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are going to be looking for work.

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Right right well.

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And it's interesting because it shifted first to the UAE

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and then to the KSA, So Saudi Arabia is a

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heavy duty player now and we'll see how China rebounds.

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I think the biggest the biggest curiosity I have with

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China is glad to see that the numbers are coming back.

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I think that's wonderful, and I think that's wonderful for

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every one of us who works in the industry. I

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do know anecdotally that that some of the companies that

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I either subcontract with or maybe subcontracting with in the

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future have also started up negotiations with expansions and new

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projects in the China market.

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I think the biggest.

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Curiosity I have, and you know, I don't whether I'm

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pretty sure you don't have this data right at your fingertips,

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but I just think it would be interesting is I'm

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curious to see what kind of international travel into China

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is going to look like. Because now, granted, for the

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first couple of years, China probably doesn't need a whole

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lot of influx of money from the outside because China

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is a big country and it's filled with people, so

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it can kind of work internally for a while. But

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one of the things that I know, I know for

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a fact just because of projects that I'm working on KSA,

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the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia is working on, is they

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want to get money coming from outside the country. They

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want to make people feel safer and safer to visit

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a place that certainly people in the United States have

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had hesitancies about visiting in the past. I know the

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UAE has gone through the same thing, and they're continuing

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to try to bring in money from not just the US,

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but also from you know, other European countries, countries that

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are significantly closer. So I'm wondering if that's part of

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China's plan as well as you say, they're earlier on

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in the in the recovery process. But you know what, what,

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if anything, I'm curious to see, what, if anything, China

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is doing or will be doing to encourage international tourism

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and bringing people in from outside so that they can

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continue to to bring money into the country as opposed

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to just using money that is within the country.

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I don't know.

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That's just the first thing I think of when I

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think of the China expansion, because I know a lot

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of people who are concerned about about visiting China.

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I know a lot.

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Of course, there's a lot of people who are concerned about

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visiting the Middle East as well, and so I'm just

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knowing some of the things that the Middle East has

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done to.

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Sort of.

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Put those put those fears aside and make people feel

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comfortable to travel there. I'm just curious if that's part

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of the China plan as well, because I know it

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is a huge part of the Saudi Arabian plan.

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That is very interesting. I don't know. I'm honestly not

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sure if they've talked about that or not. I only,

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you know, came across this one study, But I don't

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know if they've talked about it and not.

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You know, like you know, tourism sectors.

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Sure about it, and please, I don't mean, I don't

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mean to put you on the spot, but you have

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a much better understanding of this region of the world

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than I do, so.

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Well it you know, the only thing I don't know

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the answer to that. I think that it's a really

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valid point, and it's like something that follows, you know,

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I know normally, you know, domestic recovers, and I mean,

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just look at Orlando's a great you know, domestic recovered first,

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and then then now they're trying to bring international because

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it makes up what twenty five thirty percent you know,

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of their revenue, and you know that's you know, it's

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making it friendly for that to come in. Is is

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really essential for tourism, And I am wondering, I think

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I would guess, just total guessing that they haven't looked

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at that yet because of just how much, like you said,

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population is within China itself, so just recovering the main

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population going to these things is enormous. But the only

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thing I remember, and this was back when I was touring,

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touring other sectors, but when I'm back when I was

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at the summit in Uee, which was before you went there,

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so it is like like a long time ago, but

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I just remember essentially they were talking about or essentially

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there was like some worry with the with with the

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China at that time, with the Chinese development, because essentially

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it was kind of like people vying for the dollars

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of the more wealthy Chinese families. Because essentially what they

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were trying to do was pull the wealthy families, like

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if you can afford to leave China, they want you

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to go there. They want you to go to that

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They want you to go to that area instead of

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coming to the US. You know that that was a

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piece of the of the tourism, you know, the Thirty

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Year Plan or whatever was like pulling other people from

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this area. So I think and every country has that struggle,

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we know, Right, The question is like you know that

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the people that have the money, the one percent or

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even the ten percent that can afford you know, most

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of the Chinese population, you know, is just going to

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go locally and they're gonna send their towison dollars locally

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and maybe they can move from one sector to the other.

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But the one percent that really have the money to spend,

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where are they going to go? And you always want

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them to stay locally in your country, right, But then

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you have these these areas vying for each other. I

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mean a lot of people. You know, I think we

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underestimate in the US how many people come to Orlando

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or they come to the US only and they invest

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in the dollar just because it's the best the part

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capital of the world. But if that shifts to China

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or to and if other regions, then are we you know,

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there's a lot of that we're losing as well. But

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so I'm not sure if that's also or I'm sure

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that's also in play in terms of how do we

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keep these not do we just recover, but how do

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we keep folks interesting and traveling throughout China versus you know,

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running over you know, to the Middle East, or to

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going to Orlando or to London, right, you know that

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any of those.

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Things well, and with China specifically, again, I think we'll

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I said, I think we'll see this come into play

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if we can get information shared about this, because they

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may also be holding this very they may be playing

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this particular part very close. Yeah, that's that's a very

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common thing that even I know in working with this

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part of the world. And but we'll we'll see as

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we as we move forward in their timeline, because like

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you said, we're still just at the beginning of the

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recovery timeline for them, and and or just just just

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past the beginning, coming into the middle of the recovery

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timeline for them. And uh, we'll see how how eagerly

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they they try to bring in the outside dollar.

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But you're you, you brought it.

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You brought up a good point, and that is that

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you know, their population is such that there's there's enough

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to keep these theme parks running in in China. And

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if they can keep especially the Chinese wealthy, the Chinese,

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you know, the wealthier Chinese citizens in China as opposed

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to traveling to other places like Saudi or the UAE

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or whatever, or the US, then there's money that they

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save and just keep in the country. So it's just

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it's it's just interesting because I look at I look at,

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as you say, Orlando.

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You know, there's a huge amount, a huge amount. And

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I think and I.

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Honestly think that I honestly think that Disneyland. I think

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Anaheim is to a lesser degree, but I think that

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Orlando is because you can go first, you can come

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to the US, which has a mystique all its own

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for people in different countries. Secondly, you can experience the

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Flagship Disney, the flagship Universal Parks all in one trip,

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plus every other cheesy roadside attraction you could ever possibly want.

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It's called My Drive just you know right there.

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It's so like I said, I was just curious to

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see if if China had mentioned anything about that yet.

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I think we should probably keep an eye on that

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and see if that comes up in the future because

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that could be very interesting.

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Well, our next story, I think is very parallel to this,

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but potentially I think is a plan to try and

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attract some of those luxury tourists, you know, which is

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an interesting play. Again, I feel like it's a little

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bit like Star Cruser play. But so the next story

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is that there's there's a pretty big new luxury resort

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opening in Mexico. And this has been a project's been

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in the works for a while, but this past week

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before right before Thanksgiving, we actually got the details, like

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the act, like the full details of the rides and

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the manufacturers and the whole thing, which generally means that

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it's pretty you know, it's it's pretty close to to

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I mean, it's already sections have already been built. But

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I think this means it's it's pretty far down the pipeline,

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so I'm going to read here excerpts from the press release.

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It says Mexico's Group this week revealed details about its

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new theme park in Nuevo Valerta, a reported US one

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point three billion dollar projects. That's US one point three

244
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billion dollars. The luxury theme park will offer five new

245
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vacoma attractions, as well as rides from Intimate and mac Rides,

246
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plus a new dinner show from Starksla. Those are big

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names that are all called in this project.

248
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Where's the industry?

249
00:12:22.039 --> 00:12:24.879
Yeah, bon is the acronym for beauty of nature and

250
00:12:24.919 --> 00:12:27.960
the park is is scheduled to open in twenty twenty six,

251
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which is we just talked about that timeline. But yeah,

252
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so Epic twenty twenty five, twenty twenty six. You know,

253
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Mexico is kind of right behind us in terms of

254
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opening and so this this lines up. Bond Luxury E

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Theme Park is a monumental leap forward in the world

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of entertainment, redefining what a theme park can be. As

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the world's first all generations luxury destination, the executive vice president,

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Yvon Chavez said, with its seamless blend of cutting edge innovation,

259
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abundant natural beauty, and unparalleled luxury, then down to World's

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bond sets a new global standard for experience entertainment. Our

261
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collaboration with the industry's leading visionaries ensures that the attraction

262
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will not only captivate guests of all ages, but also

263
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establish itself as one of the most iconic and transformation

264
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destinations in the world. Again, I don't know about all

265
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of that, but we have names and styles and concept

266
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art for all of the rides. I'm only going to

267
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kind of just mention some of the ones from Bocoma

268
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because they're the largest ones. But they have the Latin

269
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America's first double launch coaster, they have a suspended family coaster,

270
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a sit down family coaster, a switchback mind train, a

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boat ride, and they have, like I said, four or

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five other rides that's planned from me from mac and whatnot.

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And the circ Desolay production will be Ludo and it's

274
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set to open in November twenty twenty five and it

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is housed in a state of the art custom theater

276
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featuring a stunning three to sixty degree aquatic stage. Its

277
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innovative production integrates water as a central narrative element, captivating

278
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audiences with mesmerizing visuals, gravity defined performances, and unparalleled gourmet

279
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dying experience. O wow, oh he said, yeah, oh yes, oh, oh,

280
00:14:03.919 --> 00:14:05.320
sounds sounds familiar.

281
00:14:05.440 --> 00:14:06.559
Where have I heard this before?

282
00:14:06.679 --> 00:14:11.919
It's it's oh with food, which is, you know, very interesting.

283
00:14:12.000 --> 00:14:14.360
What I wanted. Actually, that was what was missing from

284
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the Oh you know.

285
00:14:17.320 --> 00:14:19.120
Can we have some seafood? Can we have some seafood

286
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while we're watching?

287
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Oh?

288
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Come on? Yeah?

289
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So uh yeah.

290
00:14:23.039 --> 00:14:25.960
So I think that it truly does sound like this

291
00:14:26.080 --> 00:14:29.279
resort plan has literally something for everybody, from the dual

292
00:14:29.320 --> 00:14:31.000
coaster all the way to the search show, you know,

293
00:14:31.039 --> 00:14:33.919
to the other amenities that I already have on this property.

294
00:14:34.000 --> 00:14:36.159
Because this is a development, this is like a new

295
00:14:36.200 --> 00:14:40.759
phase of existing development, so there's already infrastructure there. So

296
00:14:41.639 --> 00:14:43.879
I think it sounds very exciting. But what I'm wondering

297
00:14:44.000 --> 00:14:47.759
is who it's for, because it sounds expensive, like it

298
00:14:47.799 --> 00:14:50.480
sounds like the admission is going to be expensive, and

299
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I'm wondering who it's for, and it makes me think

300
00:14:53.799 --> 00:14:55.919
that it might be what we just talked about, which

301
00:14:55.960 --> 00:14:58.200
is a little bit like they're trying to pull people

302
00:14:58.919 --> 00:15:01.360
who are looking for a destination to travel. Maybe you're

303
00:15:01.639 --> 00:15:06.120
pulling people from outside the region, or I guess I

304
00:15:06.159 --> 00:15:09.240
don't know enough about the local economy local economy, so

305
00:15:09.279 --> 00:15:11.799
maybe i'm maybe I'm I'm my.

306
00:15:11.840 --> 00:15:12.519
Reasoning is off.

307
00:15:12.559 --> 00:15:14.440
But to me, I'm like, well, this seems like, you know,

308
00:15:14.480 --> 00:15:16.639
pretty expensive, and I'm not sure how much of it

309
00:15:16.639 --> 00:15:18.480
it's going to be powered by locals or if it's

310
00:15:18.360 --> 00:15:21.000
a play for international tourism.

311
00:15:21.240 --> 00:15:24.440
You know, I don't know, can it compete with other destinations?

312
00:15:24.480 --> 00:15:27.840
I don't know well, and I'm not sure where Nueva

313
00:15:27.879 --> 00:15:31.639
Vaarta is. But it sounds to me like this is

314
00:15:32.039 --> 00:15:38.679
an attempt to to to suck audience from either the

315
00:15:38.720 --> 00:15:40.360
California or the Las Vegas market.

316
00:15:41.399 --> 00:15:44.759
But maybe I'm wrong. I don't know it.

317
00:15:44.759 --> 00:15:45.720
It sounds interesting.

318
00:15:46.159 --> 00:15:47.039
I agree with you.

319
00:15:47.120 --> 00:15:50.399
It's to me the messaging because I've I've also read

320
00:15:50.559 --> 00:15:53.679
bits and pieces of this, and the messaging is mixed,

321
00:15:53.879 --> 00:16:01.360
in my opinion, to to talk about a multi generational luxury.

322
00:16:01.720 --> 00:16:04.080
They keep using luxury and high end and you know,

323
00:16:04.200 --> 00:16:06.519
transformative and all that kind of thing, and then they

324
00:16:06.559 --> 00:16:09.759
talk about double launch coasters and suspended family coasters, and

325
00:16:10.080 --> 00:16:13.360
you know, for me here in Florida, it sounds kind

326
00:16:13.360 --> 00:16:17.559
of sounds kind of like, uh, Bush Gardens with a

327
00:16:17.559 --> 00:16:23.759
cirk show. I mean, it's like I said, I'm curious.

328
00:16:23.840 --> 00:16:26.519
I'm curious to see who they're who they're trying to attract.

329
00:16:26.600 --> 00:16:28.679
And I think that once we get the first round

330
00:16:28.679 --> 00:16:32.600
of marketing media out, we'll have a little bit better idea.

331
00:16:33.360 --> 00:16:36.919
So yeah, just for reference or people listening. So, uh,

332
00:16:36.960 --> 00:16:40.720
it is on Mexico's specific coast, just north of Puerto Erta,

333
00:16:41.399 --> 00:16:45.200
and it sits in that bay, and so potentially this

334
00:16:45.320 --> 00:16:48.080
is like a cruise play, you know, like a cruise

335
00:16:48.120 --> 00:16:48.519
line play.

336
00:16:48.639 --> 00:16:52.039
I don't know. I mean, I don't cruise. You cruise, Scott,

337
00:16:52.080 --> 00:16:52.559
you tell me.

338
00:16:53.159 --> 00:16:55.879
Yeah, it's so if it is so point off, I

339
00:16:55.960 --> 00:17:00.159
art is a huge cruise port. And if it's you know,

340
00:17:00.200 --> 00:17:03.399
if it's within even even an hour.

341
00:17:03.279 --> 00:17:05.839
Right on the coast, it's right like it's right like

342
00:17:06.920 --> 00:17:10.240
it is on the coast, like just up I would say,

343
00:17:10.319 --> 00:17:12.880
it's like ten minutes up from part the wire tail,

344
00:17:12.920 --> 00:17:14.200
like it's right north.

345
00:17:14.000 --> 00:17:17.480
Of on the coast, you know, but just up north

346
00:17:17.519 --> 00:17:18.000
a little bit.

347
00:17:18.440 --> 00:17:22.039
Then it looks like it looks like they are going

348
00:17:22.079 --> 00:17:24.200
to look for some to pull from some of the

349
00:17:24.200 --> 00:17:27.759
cruise some of the cruise industry. Have there been and

350
00:17:27.839 --> 00:17:29.960
I haven't. I haven't seen this anywhere.

351
00:17:30.000 --> 00:17:36.039
Are there are there luxury hotels on the on the premises?

352
00:17:37.440 --> 00:17:37.759
Yes.

353
00:17:38.039 --> 00:17:42.160
My understanding is there already is a few that are

354
00:17:42.640 --> 00:17:45.920
there and this is just an expansion, Like there's a

355
00:17:47.039 --> 00:17:49.359
there's quite a few, or not quite a few, but

356
00:17:49.400 --> 00:17:53.319
I mean like there's the what's that the Grand Belas

357
00:17:53.440 --> 00:17:56.279
which is located right there, which is a five star hotel.

358
00:17:56.480 --> 00:18:00.000
It's like right on the property that's a paradise village

359
00:18:00.160 --> 00:18:02.119
beach resort and Spa which is a four star hotel.

360
00:18:02.160 --> 00:18:04.519
So there's some that are already open that are kind

361
00:18:04.519 --> 00:18:07.880
of surrounding this patch of land that they're developing especially.

362
00:18:07.960 --> 00:18:10.920
So but I yeah, this this could very easily be

363
00:18:11.119 --> 00:18:14.039
a day trip when people come in, you know, cruising

364
00:18:14.039 --> 00:18:17.640
out of La or or yeah, San Diego or any

365
00:18:17.680 --> 00:18:19.559
of those, any of the California cruise ports.

366
00:18:19.799 --> 00:18:23.359
They all stop at Porta Ferota. It's uh, those look at.

367
00:18:23.279 --> 00:18:25.480
A day and so I guess that's there because I

368
00:18:25.480 --> 00:18:27.240
mean it's pretty. I mean, I don't know, I don't know.

369
00:18:27.279 --> 00:18:27.880
I have no idea.

370
00:18:27.920 --> 00:18:30.000
I would be a good question to know if if

371
00:18:30.119 --> 00:18:33.880
if like a lot of local tourism you know, goes there.

372
00:18:33.880 --> 00:18:35.839
I mean, because it's pretty far from Mexico City, you

373
00:18:35.880 --> 00:18:37.440
know what I mean. I mean, it's like it's I'm

374
00:18:37.480 --> 00:18:39.880
not sure if how much of the local places are

375
00:18:39.920 --> 00:18:41.160
going to run over there, but I don't know.

376
00:18:41.160 --> 00:18:42.240
It seems like a really.

377
00:18:43.839 --> 00:18:47.480
A large expansion for that area, and so maybe the

378
00:18:47.519 --> 00:18:51.720
play is that it's a it is a big investment,

379
00:18:51.720 --> 00:18:54.279
but they're hoping that it will draw that foot traffic

380
00:18:54.319 --> 00:18:55.759
that already is coming to that port.

381
00:18:55.799 --> 00:18:58.599
I guess, well, and what would and I don't know this,

382
00:18:58.640 --> 00:19:00.119
I'd have to do a little bit more research, but

383
00:19:00.640 --> 00:19:04.119
if there are and I'm sure there are some cruises

384
00:19:04.160 --> 00:19:07.160
that originate in Porto Varta, then it's quite possible that

385
00:19:07.200 --> 00:19:09.480
they could be trying to get that extended stay either

386
00:19:09.519 --> 00:19:12.519
before or after the cruise as well. That would make

387
00:19:12.559 --> 00:19:14.960
that would make a lot of sense. This is one

388
00:19:15.000 --> 00:19:18.119
of those that I would it sounds like there, it

389
00:19:18.200 --> 00:19:19.799
sounds like they're trying to make it more of a

390
00:19:19.839 --> 00:19:24.599
destination than a day trip. So yeah, we'll see how

391
00:19:24.599 --> 00:19:26.920
this one pans out as well. Because everything they used

392
00:19:26.920 --> 00:19:30.079
to describe it and everything I've seen, even the concept art,

393
00:19:30.440 --> 00:19:34.400
has all been focused on the luxury, not a whole lot. Now,

394
00:19:34.440 --> 00:19:36.319
I haven't seen the I haven't seen the concept art

395
00:19:36.319 --> 00:19:38.160
for the for the coasters and for the rides and such.

396
00:19:38.359 --> 00:19:41.720
But for the area and for the search show, the

397
00:19:41.759 --> 00:19:45.880
concept art all looks super posh, super high end and

398
00:19:45.960 --> 00:19:50.279
as you say, very expensive. So we'll see, we'll see

399
00:19:50.319 --> 00:19:53.079
who this targets and we'll see if it if it

400
00:19:53.119 --> 00:19:53.680
hits the mark.

401
00:19:55.599 --> 00:19:55.839
Wow.

402
00:19:56.160 --> 00:19:59.599
Speaking of hitting the mark, Mattel Adventure Park has not

403
00:20:00.119 --> 00:20:03.240
hit their mark. So this news came out a few

404
00:20:03.240 --> 00:20:05.200
weeks ago, but we just we haven't covered it because

405
00:20:05.240 --> 00:20:07.480
I open a bunch of other stuff. But essentially, Mattel

406
00:20:07.519 --> 00:20:12.359
Bensure Park is delayed again. It's the most so it's

407
00:20:12.400 --> 00:20:15.079
been delayed several times. The last it was supposed to

408
00:20:15.160 --> 00:20:17.440
be late twenty twenty four, so like this like now,

409
00:20:17.519 --> 00:20:20.400
like this month, basically, and they've bumped it to twenty

410
00:20:20.480 --> 00:20:23.559
twenty five. They haven't given an official date for twenty

411
00:20:23.559 --> 00:20:26.359
twenty five either. They just said twenty twenty five. And

412
00:20:27.720 --> 00:20:32.640
the resort statement said that the VII Resort has greatly

413
00:20:32.640 --> 00:20:36.119
expanded its initial vision for the Glendale property. These vast

414
00:20:36.160 --> 00:20:39.400
expansions in packed hospitality, dying and other entertainment offerings and

415
00:20:39.400 --> 00:20:42.119
remain under construction. Matteil Bensure Park is a key anchor

416
00:20:42.160 --> 00:20:44.480
tenant to the resort to ensure the best experience of

417
00:20:44.519 --> 00:20:46.720
our guests. Mattel Bencherpark will open twenty twenty five, is

418
00:20:46.759 --> 00:20:51.720
part of the resorts Phase one opening period. So it's

419
00:20:51.960 --> 00:20:55.839
essentially it sounds like they're attributing it. I know, I

420
00:20:55.880 --> 00:20:58.200
read a few other excerpts about it, but it sounds

421
00:20:58.200 --> 00:21:02.839
like they're attributing it just to like partly zoning, like

422
00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:08.759
as the expansion, as the scope of the resort expanded,

423
00:21:09.599 --> 00:21:12.039
there's a little bit of rethinking that needs to be done,

424
00:21:12.079 --> 00:21:14.039
I think, and that's where they kind of hit into it,

425
00:21:14.119 --> 00:21:17.680
or at least that's their official statement, right, you're right,

426
00:21:17.960 --> 00:21:20.599
who knows what the I mean? Like we had talked about,

427
00:21:20.640 --> 00:21:22.400
I think even previous in the last one. I mean,

428
00:21:22.720 --> 00:21:27.359
you know, there has been price inflation since the reopening,

429
00:21:27.480 --> 00:21:30.079
you know, especially of supply chains and easing and all that,

430
00:21:31.079 --> 00:21:33.079
and prices don't tend to go down. So a lot

431
00:21:33.119 --> 00:21:37.359
of the you know, steel prices or the core prices

432
00:21:37.400 --> 00:21:41.000
of items that inflated up because of supply chains, not

433
00:21:41.079 --> 00:21:43.160
a lot of them have gone back down, and so

434
00:21:43.200 --> 00:21:46.319
there's overall costs of increase. And then that's not to

435
00:21:46.319 --> 00:21:49.359
mention the uncertainty with the tariff stuff happening right now.

436
00:21:49.440 --> 00:21:53.319
I mean that could also inflate prices and cause delays

437
00:21:53.359 --> 00:21:54.359
on all sorts of items.

438
00:21:54.359 --> 00:21:56.000
And so who knows, I.

439
00:21:56.000 --> 00:21:57.359
Don't know, I don't I'm not sure what the real

440
00:21:57.400 --> 00:22:00.160
real reason is other than what they've stated. But you know,

441
00:22:00.319 --> 00:22:02.200
it's not the only thing to have been delayed this year,

442
00:22:02.240 --> 00:22:05.359
and we've talked about a few other delays as well,

443
00:22:05.400 --> 00:22:08.079
and so I think I think my prediction is this

444
00:22:08.119 --> 00:22:11.000
could be you know, a little bit of a foreshadowing

445
00:22:11.200 --> 00:22:15.359
for other large delays as we continue to struggle with

446
00:22:15.400 --> 00:22:18.480
supply chain, we continue to struggle with potentially tariffs or

447
00:22:18.519 --> 00:22:21.920
not tariffs, or I don't know, even even the idea

448
00:22:21.960 --> 00:22:24.880
that there could be tariffs has been causing chaos. And

449
00:22:24.880 --> 00:22:28.759
I think that's the point, right that in ripples throughout

450
00:22:28.799 --> 00:22:29.680
our industry for sure.

451
00:22:30.519 --> 00:22:32.960
Yeah, And I think that I think that you know,

452
00:22:33.039 --> 00:22:38.880
if they're talking about if they're talking about changes and tweaks,

453
00:22:39.640 --> 00:22:42.759
you know, we do know, and you understand it just

454
00:22:42.799 --> 00:22:44.839
based on where you live, you understand it better than

455
00:22:44.880 --> 00:22:47.160
I do. That once that happens, then there's all kinds

456
00:22:47.200 --> 00:22:51.359
of governmental changes that have to happen as well. The

457
00:22:51.400 --> 00:22:56.400
moment you you expand by you know, fifteen feet in

458
00:22:56.400 --> 00:22:58.440
one direction, you then have to look at zoning and

459
00:22:58.559 --> 00:23:01.559
things have to be rezoned and blah blahah blah blah.

460
00:23:01.960 --> 00:23:06.240
But I to me it and again I'm gonna play

461
00:23:06.240 --> 00:23:08.839
conspiracy theorists here just for a moment. It does sound

462
00:23:08.880 --> 00:23:12.160
a little bit like they're kicking kicking the opening down

463
00:23:12.240 --> 00:23:14.519
the street just a little bit to find out what

464
00:23:14.680 --> 00:23:17.319
is going to happen with Tariff's change of government.

465
00:23:17.079 --> 00:23:18.519
Et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

466
00:23:19.319 --> 00:23:22.519
I think we're going to see I think we're going

467
00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:25.720
to see a little bit of a lull, not just

468
00:23:25.759 --> 00:23:29.960
because of the holidays, but because of the the the

469
00:23:30.079 --> 00:23:31.799
change of presidency in the US. I think we're gonna

470
00:23:31.799 --> 00:23:33.920
see a little bit of alow just so people can

471
00:23:34.039 --> 00:23:36.279
kind of see what's going to happen here.

472
00:23:36.680 --> 00:23:41.640
So, Yeah, markets don't like uncertainty, right course, And you

473
00:23:41.680 --> 00:23:44.880
know a lot of the capital that uh that that

474
00:23:45.039 --> 00:23:48.000
comes for these large at least the large projects, right

475
00:23:48.079 --> 00:23:51.039
is capital. And and to get the capital, you need

476
00:23:51.079 --> 00:23:53.400
certain markets essentially or the market seed to be you know,

477
00:23:53.640 --> 00:23:57.000
feel certain about especially tourism. I mean, like I just

478
00:23:57.000 --> 00:24:00.000
feel like a slight wind impacts tourism, right, It's like

479
00:24:00.119 --> 00:24:04.079
any anything that happens. We're one of the most volatile sectors,

480
00:24:04.119 --> 00:24:07.039
just because you know, it's like how a consumer is feeling,

481
00:24:07.160 --> 00:24:09.039
how much money they have, how much is gas, like

482
00:24:09.160 --> 00:24:13.640
how much Literally every element in the economy impacts tourism

483
00:24:13.759 --> 00:24:17.079
because it ultimately is something that it's not a necessity,

484
00:24:17.759 --> 00:24:19.880
and it's I mean, you.

485
00:24:19.880 --> 00:24:20.400
Could argue that.

486
00:24:20.440 --> 00:24:22.000
I think a lot of people argue it is a

487
00:24:22.039 --> 00:24:24.119
necessity because you need a little bit of escapism and

488
00:24:24.160 --> 00:24:25.319
fun and et cetera, et cetera.

489
00:24:25.680 --> 00:24:27.960
So I think it's a necessity.

490
00:24:28.039 --> 00:24:31.119
But if, for example, there was a war going on

491
00:24:31.359 --> 00:24:35.119
in a specific country, it's no longer a necessity. You know,

492
00:24:35.200 --> 00:24:37.519
it's the first thing to get shifted down in the

493
00:24:37.519 --> 00:24:38.200
priority list.

494
00:24:38.359 --> 00:24:41.000
Yeah, and you generally choose food, right, and those kind

495
00:24:41.000 --> 00:24:44.599
of things shelter, you know, basic Yeah, right, it's not

496
00:24:44.640 --> 00:24:47.200
one of those basic things. And so I think so

497
00:24:47.880 --> 00:24:50.920
all these things ripple into the tourism sector, and especially

498
00:24:51.000 --> 00:24:53.680
when capital is harder to secure, if you know, the

499
00:24:54.079 --> 00:24:57.160
market is uncertain, especially about tourism and about the construction

500
00:24:57.279 --> 00:24:59.759
costs and whatnot. So I think to your point exactly,

501
00:25:01.079 --> 00:25:03.200
it could be a delaying tactic as well to shore

502
00:25:03.240 --> 00:25:05.559
up some of that. But I think a lot of

503
00:25:05.799 --> 00:25:09.680
projects are kind of pausing to wonder or I've seen

504
00:25:09.759 --> 00:25:11.960
both things. Just from our side at Ghantam, we've seen

505
00:25:11.960 --> 00:25:15.559
the same thing. Yeah, we've seen people done before the tariffs.

506
00:25:15.640 --> 00:25:17.599
Let's get it done before the tariffs hit kicking. Yeah,

507
00:25:17.640 --> 00:25:20.480
we have seen a lot of folks trying to push

508
00:25:20.559 --> 00:25:23.240
through quotes and push through projects because you know, a

509
00:25:23.240 --> 00:25:27.599
lot of the way this works is bidding, right, so

510
00:25:27.920 --> 00:25:30.119
and it's so complicated because some of these projects have

511
00:25:30.359 --> 00:25:34.160
so many vendors, right, that are involved, but essentially every

512
00:25:34.240 --> 00:25:37.759
vendor gives a quote, right, and our quotes, I think

513
00:25:37.759 --> 00:25:41.079
most quotes are ninety days, but ours are thirty at Gantum,

514
00:25:41.599 --> 00:25:43.559
And so what happens is a lot of people are

515
00:25:43.559 --> 00:25:45.960
trying to get quotes in by the end of December,

516
00:25:46.000 --> 00:25:48.200
so like literally wait until December twenty nine to twenty

517
00:25:48.319 --> 00:25:50.319
thirtieth to get a quote so that it's going to

518
00:25:50.359 --> 00:25:53.240
be valid to the first thirty days of twenty twenty five,

519
00:25:53.519 --> 00:25:56.440
you know, just to protect that price and then see

520
00:25:56.440 --> 00:25:58.920
if they can push new budgets in to you know,

521
00:25:58.960 --> 00:26:01.519
the new budget over and they can purchase something well

522
00:26:01.559 --> 00:26:05.960
at the same price. Because once your quote expires, right, like,

523
00:26:06.039 --> 00:26:07.920
then you have to re quote the entire thing. And

524
00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:12.279
if there have been terrorists or any price fluctuations, then

525
00:26:12.799 --> 00:26:16.039
it's gonna potentially delay the project because that's what happened, right,

526
00:26:16.759 --> 00:26:19.160
Price changes happen, and then you have to go back

527
00:26:19.480 --> 00:26:21.319
and like, you know, there's so many committees at some

528
00:26:21.359 --> 00:26:23.519
of these things that are you know, I mean, yeah,

529
00:26:23.559 --> 00:26:26.039
it's in some wonder or anything ever gets done well.

530
00:26:26.279 --> 00:26:29.000
But it's interesting because again, even me and I don't

531
00:26:29.039 --> 00:26:31.640
have to worry about tariffs that much. I don't have

532
00:26:32.079 --> 00:26:36.559
hard product, but I do know what's kind of going

533
00:26:36.640 --> 00:26:38.720
on I have. I have to be aware of what's

534
00:26:38.759 --> 00:26:41.799
going on with hard product because it doesn't impact you know,

535
00:26:41.839 --> 00:26:43.839
how much time it's going to take me to work

536
00:26:43.880 --> 00:26:47.680
and creative direct my way through the installation of a project.

537
00:26:48.119 --> 00:26:52.359
And even I've brought my quotes down to thirty days now.

538
00:26:52.920 --> 00:26:55.160
They used to be ninety. But I've brought my quote

539
00:26:55.200 --> 00:26:57.519
down to my quotes. The majority of my quotes if

540
00:26:57.519 --> 00:27:00.279
it's a returning client, I'll keep them longer. But but

541
00:27:00.359 --> 00:27:03.799
I've even brought my quotes down for the vast majority

542
00:27:03.799 --> 00:27:06.000
to thirty days for exactly that reason, because I'm not

543
00:27:06.079 --> 00:27:07.359
quite sure what's going to happen next.

544
00:27:08.079 --> 00:27:08.319
Yep.

545
00:27:09.119 --> 00:27:12.359
Yeah, And it is a balancing act, you know, the

546
00:27:12.359 --> 00:27:15.279
people are adjusting their quote times, manufacturers are. But then

547
00:27:15.720 --> 00:27:18.640
also it depends on the terms that the customer can get,

548
00:27:18.720 --> 00:27:22.400
or if they're going through a fulfillment place, the terms

549
00:27:22.400 --> 00:27:24.000
that place can get. Because a lot, you know, a

550
00:27:24.000 --> 00:27:27.640
lot of a lot of the larger companies will give

551
00:27:27.680 --> 00:27:31.480
their good clients net ninety. So you know, it's a

552
00:27:31.480 --> 00:27:34.039
weird math game, right where you're like, okay, well the

553
00:27:34.119 --> 00:27:36.680
quote's valid for ninety days and then we have net ninety.

554
00:27:36.759 --> 00:27:40.240
So potentially, if we wait until the last day and

555
00:27:40.279 --> 00:27:41.759
we have customers to do this, which is why we

556
00:27:41.759 --> 00:27:43.079
adjust ours, we're too small.

557
00:27:43.319 --> 00:27:45.640
But you see frequently customers do this.

558
00:27:45.640 --> 00:27:47.519
Well, they'll push it all the way to like the

559
00:27:47.559 --> 00:27:50.759
eighty ninth day that the quote is valid, right, and

560
00:27:50.799 --> 00:27:52.880
then they'll purchase on that day and then they have

561
00:27:53.000 --> 00:27:56.759
net ninety. So you're really you're extending the certainty out

562
00:27:57.119 --> 00:27:59.799
up to six months, which is before you actually have

563
00:27:59.839 --> 00:28:04.440
to pay, which I mean, it's a good strategy if

564
00:28:04.480 --> 00:28:07.240
you are unsure right which right now, if you're unsure

565
00:28:07.279 --> 00:28:09.960
of how the pricing might change in the next you know,

566
00:28:10.079 --> 00:28:12.319
six months, and you really want to push it out,

567
00:28:12.319 --> 00:28:13.559
then you're going to quote at the end, and then

568
00:28:13.599 --> 00:28:15.759
you're going to delay, delay, delay, and kind of just

569
00:28:15.839 --> 00:28:18.400
push to make sure that you still have the funding

570
00:28:18.400 --> 00:28:21.359
for the project. We don't work that way, you know,

571
00:28:21.400 --> 00:28:24.680
we we don't. Most of our customers are on prepay

572
00:28:25.240 --> 00:28:28.039
and we only do thirty day quotes, and so we're

573
00:28:29.400 --> 00:28:31.240
very much the opposite of that.

574
00:28:31.440 --> 00:28:34.160
But again, that's why theme.

575
00:28:34.000 --> 00:28:36.839
Parks they buy through integrators, right, I mean, like that's

576
00:28:36.880 --> 00:28:39.880
almost the purpose in my view as a manufacturer, that's

577
00:28:39.920 --> 00:28:41.839
the purpose a lot of a lot of these fulfillment

578
00:28:41.920 --> 00:28:44.880
integrators or whatnot is literally just to serve as a

579
00:28:44.920 --> 00:28:48.079
bank and a credit card and a warehouse. And that's

580
00:28:48.079 --> 00:28:49.400
what you pay them for, you know, that's what they

581
00:28:49.400 --> 00:28:52.720
get the margin for. Is like like Murphy here, you know,

582
00:28:52.759 --> 00:28:56.680
in Orlando. Here, Murphy in Orlando is like, you know,

583
00:28:57.880 --> 00:28:58.920
all they do is really just like.

584
00:28:58.920 --> 00:29:00.519
You're sure you're not in Orlando. I just wanted to

585
00:29:00.519 --> 00:29:01.079
point that out.

586
00:29:01.319 --> 00:29:04.599
Yeah, I know, I would like here in your brain,

587
00:29:05.119 --> 00:29:06.319
you're in Orlando.

588
00:29:06.599 --> 00:29:08.000
Brain, but not in reality.

589
00:29:08.000 --> 00:29:13.079
But reality, they'll.

590
00:29:11.480 --> 00:29:15.160
Receive items and hold everything there until delivery on site,

591
00:29:15.200 --> 00:29:18.279
you know, for the end customer, you know, the park

592
00:29:18.400 --> 00:29:21.839
or the venue or whatever. But they'll essentially they are

593
00:29:21.839 --> 00:29:24.839
a credit card, partial credit card, impartial because then you know,

594
00:29:24.920 --> 00:29:28.000
then they negotiate terms with them and whatnot. So yeah,

595
00:29:28.160 --> 00:29:32.480
I mean, I don't know. It's a weird, complicated game

596
00:29:32.519 --> 00:29:35.720
that there's so much that impacts the price of these

597
00:29:35.759 --> 00:29:39.720
projects and the viability of them from different folks, and

598
00:29:40.039 --> 00:29:42.839
any of these economic ripples just touch every corner of

599
00:29:42.880 --> 00:29:43.200
it well.

600
00:29:43.200 --> 00:29:46.000
And as you say, you know, the market and more importantly,

601
00:29:46.000 --> 00:29:49.920
the capital investors do not like uncertainty. So it's it's

602
00:29:49.960 --> 00:29:52.960
going to be interesting to see how we make this transition.

603
00:29:53.079 --> 00:29:55.359
It's going to be interesting to see how things happen

604
00:29:55.440 --> 00:29:57.680
after this transition. And it's going to be interesting to

605
00:29:57.680 --> 00:30:01.839
see how many of these i'll call them threats, but

606
00:30:02.039 --> 00:30:05.799
how many of these promises made during an election year

607
00:30:06.640 --> 00:30:13.079
actually become reality and how that impacts Quite honestly, the

608
00:30:13.119 --> 00:30:15.880
people who voted to put the new administration in So

609
00:30:16.440 --> 00:30:18.920
I have no idea I don't think anybody does, and

610
00:30:18.960 --> 00:30:22.680
I think we're all just kind of biding for time

611
00:30:23.920 --> 00:30:26.680
so that we can make sure that the industry does

612
00:30:26.839 --> 00:30:30.400
continue to be successful. And I don't think that's just

613
00:30:30.440 --> 00:30:32.559
the entertainment industry or just the theme park industry or

614
00:30:32.559 --> 00:30:33.359
the attractions industry.

615
00:30:33.359 --> 00:30:34.240
I think it's all industry.

616
00:30:34.279 --> 00:30:36.279
So we're just kind of just kind of biding for

617
00:30:36.359 --> 00:30:38.960
time to see how everything kind of shakes out. And

618
00:30:39.000 --> 00:30:41.599
we would love to bide for time on this particular episode.

619
00:30:41.640 --> 00:30:44.680
Unfortunately we're out of it, so this is the end

620
00:30:44.720 --> 00:30:49.200
of this week's However, if you are an Unhinged subscriber,

621
00:30:50.160 --> 00:30:52.319
we are going to be talking about muppets and travel

622
00:30:52.400 --> 00:30:56.079
in the Unhinged episode that we're going to record right

623
00:30:56.119 --> 00:30:57.880
after this. But for those of you who are not,

624
00:30:57.920 --> 00:30:59.839
thank you very much. We really do appreciate you. And

625
00:31:00.279 --> 00:31:02.359
if you'd like to find out what Unhinged is all about,

626
00:31:02.559 --> 00:31:05.319
please check us out on Patreon, and if not, we

627
00:31:05.359 --> 00:31:07.839
will see you next week here on Green Tagged Theme

628
00:31:07.880 --> 00:31:08.839
Park in thirty.

629
00:31:09.759 --> 00:31:12.519
And if you're thinking of someone who might enjoy Unhinged,

630
00:31:12.599 --> 00:31:14.720
we have gift packages for the holiday season. You can

631
00:31:14.720 --> 00:31:19.240
actually gift a subscription to someone you think might enjoy it.

632
00:31:19.559 --> 00:31:21.400
Wow, aren't we kind?

633
00:31:22.319 --> 00:31:24.039
It is Cyber Monday. I thought we should do.

634
00:31:24.160 --> 00:31:25.119
That's good. No, that's good.

635
00:31:25.200 --> 00:31:27.400
Yeah, we're recording this on Cyber Monday, so well we

636
00:31:27.440 --> 00:31:29.400
will be. You'll be seeing it on Cyber Monday.

637
00:31:29.119 --> 00:31:33.359
So yeah. Wow, that's that's very nice. Philip. You are

638
00:31:33.440 --> 00:31:35.119
You are such a jovial and kind soul.

639
00:31:36.599 --> 00:31:38.039
Okay, we're ending in there.