The Swing to Halloween Festivals

WEBVTT

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From our studios this week in Philadelphia
and Tampa. This is Green Tag,

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tem Perk and thirty. I'm Phillip
and I'm joined as always by my co

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host Scott Swinson of Scott Swinson Creative
Development. Howdy, how do you don't

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even know where you are? Do
you know? I was like, it's

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somewhere between Philadelphia and New York.
I is what. Philadelphia's fine, that's

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the last place I was. Somewhere
somewhere on the Eastern Seaboard, ish kind

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of thing, you know, Yeah, yeah, this is well, this

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is the season. You know,
everybody jokes that I'm always everywhere and you

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know you never know quite where I'm
gonna pop up. No, this is

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the season where Philip is everywhere around
the world looking at all things spooky.

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So yes, yes, and also
talking about all things spooky. And I

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thought, actually thought we'd start off
this week talking about the segment that I

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did live on NBC Universal during California
Live. It was a segment on Live

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TV and essentially it was a little
bit like a Haunt roundup. So they

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contacted me as a journalist that covers
Halloween things and goes to all of these

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spooky things to come on and talk
about a roundup of shows. And it

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was four minutes, and we were
supposed to cover six attractions, and it's

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California Live, so they wanted to
cover it in the areas where the show

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airs, which makes sense, right, So it was like San Francisco,

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Bay Area, LA Area and San
Diego area, so it's supposed to be

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two two and two. And I
thought we could talk a little bit about

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how that works, just because you
know, our listeners may not be familiar,

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and we have a lot of listeners
I think it would be useful for

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But so essentially me as a as
a journalist, pitched the segment to them,

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and you know, we got to
talking back and forth by doing the

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segment. And then how it worked
is I gave them a list of all

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the places I recommended that we could
talk about, and who we had b

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roll for and who we didn't and
all that kind of stuff. And then

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just because of the way, you
know, I guess like the politics in

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it, right, they said,
okay, cross all these people off because

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they usually advertise or they have advertised
or whatever, or they didn't advertise this

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year or whatever, so those get
removed or they are people that people have

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already talked about. So can't talk
about Universal because we already had people there.

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We can't talk about the immersive show
because people are there. We can't

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talk about Sea World because they're an
advertiser. So the producers kind of you

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know, will come back to me
and say this is what we want.

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So as as usual, we were
supposed to go live on Tuesday, and

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I think Sunday night they gave me
the list of places they wanted and it

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happened to be all the places that
are smaller and less well known, which

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means they had no b roll.
So I had to chase it down.

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And this is my cautionary tale to
our listeners, is that you need to

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have be role readily available for journalists
like me who are trying to write stories

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and who need them on a turnaround
of because the producers need it Monday.

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So we had twenty four hours to
get b roll for these places and it

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was shocked, and six of them
did not have it and I could not.

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I couldn't secure be role for one
of the locations, so we had

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to cut them from the story.
So they just got cut because they didn't

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have the role, and I was
texting the show director and the show director

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the show was already open really,
so they're really in my opinion, there

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wasn't an excuse not to have the
role. They were already open, right.

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He just said they hadn't shot it
yet. And it's like, well,

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we only need thirty seconds at most, you know, you need thirty

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seconds of video and it doesn't need
to It doesn't need to be too sexy.

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It just needs to be enough to
give, you know, to while

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we're talking about it. So just
play while we're talking. That's all it

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needs. And it also shocked me
to the One of them was Winchester Mystery

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House. You know, their media
kit online wasn't updated since twenty twenty,

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and the thing that the news wanted
to talk about was the new thing this

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year, which they didn't have the
roll for. Yeah. Yeah, it's

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interesting because while you're doing that on
the West coast, I've been doing that

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on the East coast, at least
certainly in the Tampa market. Because I

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was brought on to visit Tampa Bay's
podcast to do sort of the They introduced

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me as the master of all Things
Halloween, which I was like, I'll

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yeah, I'll put that on my
on my business cards. But it was

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to talk primarily about the Vault of
Souls, which is the the last event

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that I have to open here in
Tampa, but that we also talked about

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because the team from Bush Gardens Tampa
Howill Scream was on right after me.

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We also talked about the early years
of that and the inception of that and

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how I work, you know,
around the country. And then I also

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did a local Tampa affiliate, the
Fox affiliate in Tampa, to talk about

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the Vault of Souls, and that
was that was like a five minute piece

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and the and the podcast was like
thirty minutes. It was. It was

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great and but but again to your
point, if you don't have be roll,

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I was just just before we started
shooting, you know, Philip had

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told me that a lot of these
places didn't have any form of B role

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and that shocked me because every client
I've ever worked for has something and it's

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usually you know, in the pitch
process, and the pitch process works differently

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in different markets. Yep. You
know, the California market is significantly more

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crowded to get some media time,
so that's quite an accomplishment. But what

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we've found in so many of the
markets that I work in. Excuse me,

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it's the b roll that secures the
interview. So you know, as

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you said, when they didn't have
b roll, they got cut well.

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And with with my experience in the
in the we'll call them less crowded markets,

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although the Chicago market was pretty crowded, and we got into that one

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because with Terror Roulette. We got
into that one because it was newsworthy,

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new and unique and we had,
you know, not only we also offered

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them a very unique experience. We
brought them to the Haunt and to a

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scream cam of of three of the
selected rooms and then did an interview afterwards

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while holding live snakes. So you
know, you have to have that quirky

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sort of I don't know that that
unique to cut through the noise kind of

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thing, and the easiest, most
cost effective and really, as you've pointed

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out, Philip, essential way is
to have at lea thirty seconds of b

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roll. Yeah, and you know
everyone will say, well, our hunt's

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not ready or we didn't get it
done prior to the opening, blah blah

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blah blah blah. Put it on
your production schedule. Yeah, yeah,

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put bee roll shoot on your production
schedule. And it doesn't mean you have

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to shoot. You know, everyone
says, well the whole haunt isn't ready,

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or the whole experience isn't real.
It doesn't matter, It doesn't matter.

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That doesn't matter at all. Now, when we first, you know,

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many many years ago, I guess
it's nine, eight or nine years

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ago, when we first opened the
Vault of Souls, so much of our

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b roll stuff was close ups of
props with shadows passing them. Keep in

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mind, b role is to create
the emotion that the guests will feel while

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they are experiencing your attraction. It
is not a documentary per se of every

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single moment of every single room.
It is a dim sum best of snippets

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that create the emotion. Now,
at the same time, I wouldn't do

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anything that's not involved in your haunt. I wouldn't make it a complete fallacy,

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don't make it a lie. But
at the same time, have that

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have those tools in your pocket,
have not only B role but also three

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to five production stills. And this
is something that I've seen and maybe Philip

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you've seen this in other places as
well. Have an updated logo in multiple

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formats, so that when they ask
for it, you can send it to

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them. I mean, I can
promise you that if you're afraid that you're

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not getting on on you're not getting
your fair share or your fair shake on

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media, if you send them something
that is cool enough, it will it

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will spark their attention. Because keep
in mind, there's you know, there's

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a bunch of competition out there,
and sometimes they don't know who to go

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to. And in a crowded market, obviously they went to Philip because they

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knew him as a as an expert
in the field. Well, I want

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to add it on that point too, when you said about that, it's

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like because they came to me as
an independent journalist fit together, it's it's

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like I absorb all of that work, if that makes sense. So like,

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so you know, these haunts,
I think definitely would would not have

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gotten the coverage outside of it because
they weren't ready, you know. So

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me, it was like my job
because I was producing the segment quote unquote

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or whatever however you want to call
it. I was having to get them

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ready and then give it to the
producers to be ready. So for example,

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I sent I had to I sent
a film crew out to one of

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the places to get be Role,
and then the other one, I drove

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six hours to San Diego to get
be Roll Sunday night so they would have

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it on Monday. And then a
third haunt had b Role but it wasn't

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ready. It was like it was
like the whole session with the outtakes of

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their recording session. Yeah, that's
that's not be Role, that's raw food,

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correct, It was raw footage.
And so it was me Sunday night

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editing their raw footage and putting music
and trimming it down and getting it ready.

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So then, because what the producers
want is just like Scott said,

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they want want the name information little
like two sentence about section. They want

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the thirty second clip that's ready to
go, that's ready to just plug into

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their system, and they want the
logos. And I had to package all

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that together for them. But I
had to go and find it. And

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the last point I'm going to add
here is is a I think Scott said

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to have it ready, but I
would add to if you don't have somebody

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who's like full time answering your press
requests, then just put it on the

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website so at least I can find
it because that was the other thing is

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there was nobody to get in contact
with at these locations. So yeah,

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if you don't, if you don't
have a link on your website that says

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press kit, yeah, you're you're
missing out. Yeah. And I know

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that there are those people who have
said, well, I don't want to

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make that accessible to everyone, because
let the bloggers happen. It's fine,

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it's fine, exactly, Let them
have it, Let them have this.

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There was that mentality is so antiquated. It's like I want to hold all

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my all my marketing assets close to
the chest. Those days are long gone.

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Kids. You know you need to
And again I know that because I

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used to be that person. I
used to be the person that says I

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don't want to I don't want to
put stuff out there and give it all

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away. Well, then decide what
you're putting out there. Don't make your

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don't make your b roll giving it
all away. Make your b roll something

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that is a nicely little produced package. And I would I would suggest,

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now, Philip, you may disagree
with me, but I would suggest having

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it when you put it up on
your website, have a thirty second b

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roll clip, both with and without
background music. Yeah, and if you're

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using background music, make certain that
it is royalty free, or that you

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own the rights and royalties, all
rights and royalties to that piece of music,

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because sometimes, you know, as
in the case with these on these

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interviews. I can't tell you how
many interviews I've done where I thought the

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camera was on me and they're showing
b role of what I'm talking about.

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Yeah, yeah, no, I
agree with that entirely. I think thirty

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seconds is fine. They can always
loop it if it's a longer segment,

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you know, and they'll just nobody
will even notice. I think it's important

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to have music and without music.
These producers wanted no music specifically, they

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asked for that. I could have
muted it myself and sent it over.

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You know, you cannot, but
you don't want to give them any more

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work to do. You know they
can correct. You know, you don't

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want to give the editors more work
to do. And the only other thing

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I would add to that, which
we do at HUSH, is this was

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like, he doesn't listen, so
it's fine, but this is like pulling

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it was like pulling teeth to get
this. But I think it's important.

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I think it's important to have whoever
this folkesperson is, have a two minute

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news style interview with them. So
that way, because the other big thing

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for me that they asked for was
they asked for my credentials, but they

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asked for other times I've been on
TV to see what I what I looked

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like, because they're trying to vet
you, like And so if you if

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you're an independent haunt and you know
Scott has all these all that you can

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just google Scott and find him on
a new station, so you know that

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he'll perform well on TV. But
if you haven't done too many TV segments,

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I think it's worth in your media
kit having that you talking about your

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twenty twenty three season to camera so
that they know that you can clean up.

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They know that you can talk to
camera, they know that you can

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say something interesting, and if they're
really really busy, they will just take

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that and PLoP it in to a
segment right right, you know, and

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it's interesting one of the and this
is a little further down on the checklist,

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but another thing that I have seen
work incredibly well, and this is

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something that you need to do early, very early on in the season,

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is they will do to do a
Q and A. So in other words,

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you're just giving the answers and then
you provide the questions so that they

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can do a look live. So
not all not all stations like to do

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that, but if it's available to
them, it's amazing how often they'll they'll

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edit together. You know, you
going, that's an excellent question, and

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then answering the question looking slightly off
camera. Yeah. So yeah, there's

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there's all kinds of tips and tricks. I think that the real the real

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takeaway that I think we just kind
of briefed over, but I think everything

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we've said contributes to it. Make
it easy for the media outlets to advertise

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for you, make it easy for
them to do a story on you.

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The less work that the television company
or the podcaster or the bloggers, the

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less work they have to do,
the more likely it is that you're going

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to get your face and the name
of your attraction. And this is true

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not just of haunted attractions, this
is true of every attraction. Make it

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easy for people in the media to
put your stuff out there. Yep,

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yep, Okay, we're gonna move
on, because I think we could talk

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about this be a whole for days, for days for days. Okay,

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anyway, that's one of the things
we should do, Philip. We should

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actually do a session at one of
the trade shows on this is the importance

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of you know, what do you
have in your media kit? Yeah?

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I think it would be phenomenal.
If anyone has ideas from where we should

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present that, let us know.
I have an idea. So anyway,

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I'll talk to you autter the show. So we have actual news talk about

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this week that I that I found. Oh, come on, you being

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on TV, you being on NBC
is pretty is pretty pretty Newsworth. That's

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true. It is news by definition. So okay, our next news story

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is basically takeaways from the earnings report
from Disney. So so essentially, with

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Disney's restructuring, they have changed the
way that they share the financial details,

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which basically really highlights the theme park
division because you know, previously it was

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all more more like Disney as a
whole, and now they're spreading it out

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into the different divisions, and of
course theme park is its own division.

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Now they've also even itemized and split
out you know, merch from food and

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beverage from merch. Licensing fees is
really get a clearer picture, and the

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picture for Disney at least is very
positive, it says, according to a

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Wednesday filing, the theme park segment
had more than twenty four billion in overall

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revenue for the first nine months ending
in July first. That's seventeen percent higher

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than the first nine months of twenty
twenty two. They park admissions alone accounted

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for nearly eight billion of the twenty
twenty three's nine month total, up twenty

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one percent of the same period.
The article from CNBC goes on to say

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that Wednesday fil in highlights that Disney
steam park revenue continues to grow despite overall

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theme park industry slow down attendance and
hotel room occupancy. Disney Universal's domestic parks,

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as well as regional players like six
Flags and SeaWorld, have reported lower

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attendants this year. Travel agents have
appointed to higher ticket prices and arise in

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trips to Europe as major factors in
declining revenue. I don't know that I

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agree with that. To me,
we've talked about this before, But to

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me, it's more of what we've
been talking about over and over and over

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that iopas mentioned. I mean,
we knew this was going to be a

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slow down period because people have less
sposable income. And when people have less

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disposable income, they have to make
choices, and the things they're going to

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choose are the traditional things they have
for their you know. It's whatever your

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family has done for the past thirty
years, you know, or whatever the

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thing you really want to do,
you know, if you're choosing between Like

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I gave this example just yesterday as
somebody I said, Okay, say you

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have your family and you're gonna you're
gonna have to make a choice to one

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thing to go to. You could
go to Oogi BIGI Bash, you know,

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or you could go to US six
Flags if you I mean, it's

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usually a no brainer for a lot
of families that are close to there,

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you know. And even if they
have to put a little bit more on

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the credit card to pay for that
one, you know, it's you're gonna

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choose that. So I think that's
more what's going on. We're seeing these

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like these decisions have to be made, and I think it's not going to

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necessarily get better. Scott and I
have talked about this that next year it's

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going to be more competitive. You
know, you'll equal out next year,

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it'll be more of an equilibrium we'll
get back to, but it'll be back

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to needing to be competitive, you
know, you will need to be a

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competitive as attractions what, you know, just like it was in twenty nineteen

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where places were competitive and they were
adding new offerings, you know, more

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perceived value for the guest. So
that's yeah, I think I think you

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kind of hit the nail on the
head there for me, because people are

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coming back, you know, and
I know that, you know, I

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know there are people who are listening
who are going guys, COVID's done,

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forget about it. But it's not. It's not the it's ripple effect.

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Yeah, the after effects are still
very very strong and very very significant,

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not just in the attendance but also
in you know, staffing and casting and

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and the way attractions are being run. I mean, it really was like

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hitting reset. It's like hitting the
reset button. Even even down to especially

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how the younger audiences, let's say
the early college age audiences are behaving.

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I'll give you a perfect example.
They are, well, just an anecdote,

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they are if you think about it, these are kids who half of

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at least half of their high school
career was done virtually, so they didn't

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get out, they didn't go out
and play. So it changed the way

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they interact with their friends, with
attractions, with everything. And I had

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this realization while I was teaching at
University of South Florida my improv workshops there,

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and I'm seeing these kids, I'm
going, why is it so difficult

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to get them to talk to one
another? Because the whole their whole high

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school career was done on little screen
boxes, you know, or not our

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whole, but the majority of it. And so we're going to see that

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those ramifications for up to four years. I think the same is true with

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theme park. It's interesting because you
know, we talk about the tried and

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true, the traditional, those things
that people have denied themselves for maybe two

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to three years after having done them
for as Philip said, thirty years prior.

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Those are obviously going to be the
first things they go back to.

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The comfort food. I want to
go back to. I want to go

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back to this. I do optimistically
feel that looking forward. Oh and by

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the way, I think it's also
why there is a strong trend and a

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strong push now for things that families
can do together right correct, Because again,

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families have reconnected. Families reconnected during
lockdown, so doing things together as

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a family. We're even seeing it
watch television commercials, We're seeing it in

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marketing right now. It's a lot
more of it is about families doing stuff

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together. So you know you're gonna
you're definitely going to see that. I

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think it's also interesting to point out
that even though like certain certain clients of

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mine have I have had lower lower
revenue, but higher attendance, and they

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were really concerned about that. But
this is also these are also organizations that

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look at using seasonal events like Halloween
and Christmas and spring and summer, et

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cetera, et cetera, as ways
to transfer people from daily ticket buyers to

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season pass holders, and when they
go to season pass holders, their revenue

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drops, but their attendance goes up. So it's all just part of the

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process. Kids. It is nothing
to panic about. It is it is

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you know, if things are down
in your area, continue to do good

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work so that when this phase continues
to evolve, that they will not have

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gone, oh well, we went
to there, we went there. But

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they obviously just don't they're phoning it
in. They just don't care anymore.

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So it is. It's not going
to be in my if I'm going to

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put on my psychic helmet here.
It's not going to be a great year

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for the majority of smaller attractions,
but it's also not going to be a

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bad year. So recognize that although
it's not trending in a skyrocketing upward curve

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or people are coming out and it's
obviously going to be considerably better than during

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lockdown. So use this as an
opportunity to build some loyalty with your people.

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Make sure that those people who do
come have a great time so that

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they can tell their friends, and
your attendants can continue to grow in the

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following seasons. I love what you
said about comfort food. I think that's

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00:21:19.279 --> 00:21:22.599
a perfect way of thinking about it. You know, people are still there's

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a lot of people that I mean
really, I think us in the attractions

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space and our listeners were forced to
go back into public spaces because it's our

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job, right. A lot of
people were even to this year, were

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still anxious about being stuck in a
congoline at Hornites, you know, with

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thirty thousand other people in opening nights. So it was still a thing.

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And comfort food, you know,
that's the thing it's exactly right. People

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are they want that comfort food.
But I think to your point, by

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next year, what I've been telling
attractions is you need to work on staying

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competitive for next year, because when
they start to have their fill of comfort

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food, just like with anything else, they're going to start to look out

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00:22:02.799 --> 00:22:04.799
and say, oh, what new
thing can we try. But if you

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didn't use this time to really fix
your show so that you are competitive,

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then it's gonna be bad for you
next year. And I think even the

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smaller places I work with, you
know, even like a hush, right,

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that's been the focus. Fix the
show, you know, fix it,

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get it, get it working completely, you know. Make you know,

332
00:22:25.000 --> 00:22:27.759
we did renovations this year, but
we don't need to do major renovations

333
00:22:27.759 --> 00:22:32.559
next year. We just need to
fix the show. Yeah. Focus focus

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00:22:32.640 --> 00:22:37.680
on quality. Focus on quality because
quantity is not quite there yet. Quality

335
00:22:37.720 --> 00:22:41.039
of guests, so focus on quality
of experience so that when more and more

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people want to come out, you're
ready for them. And the people who

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00:22:45.960 --> 00:22:51.200
did experience your attraction this year are
are saying great things about you for next

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00:22:51.240 --> 00:22:55.400
year. Well, it's a great
segue because a lot of these themes came

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00:22:55.480 --> 00:22:57.599
up in a visit that I made
yesterday. Yesterday I went out to Eastern

340
00:22:57.640 --> 00:23:03.799
State Panteentrary, and there is a
new management team there. You know our

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00:23:03.839 --> 00:23:07.319
listener Brett, He's moved over to
shack Overfest, so there's a kind of

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00:23:07.319 --> 00:23:10.960
a new and Amy left a while
like a few years ago, so there's

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00:23:11.200 --> 00:23:14.400
a whole new team there. And
of course they're in their third year now

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of the Halloween Nights at Eastern State, which we've talked about in the past

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that that was their transition essentially into
exactly what we're talking about. They went

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00:23:22.000 --> 00:23:27.519
from a like a high contact,
op touch optional haunt, linear walkthrough haunt

347
00:23:27.799 --> 00:23:32.839
to a Halloween festival, and this
is a third ye're doing it, and

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00:23:32.880 --> 00:23:37.720
they have expanded to even almost eleven
acres that they're utilizing for this. They

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00:23:37.759 --> 00:23:41.920
have five haunted houses. They still
have the opt in touch option for the

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hont houses, but they have four
themed bar now four themed bars, and

351
00:23:45.400 --> 00:23:49.839
they have a scare zone they've added
and they've really, honestly, I think

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00:23:49.880 --> 00:23:55.359
my big takeaways where they really have
just focused on the entertainment and really on

353
00:23:55.440 --> 00:24:00.400
making it more family and more just
generic. So basically it really feels like

354
00:24:00.720 --> 00:24:04.720
because it's one gate price. It
feels like a miniature theme park, and

355
00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:08.920
it feels like you're paying one gay
price to go in and the parents can

356
00:24:11.079 --> 00:24:15.319
enjoy the fun areas and the kids
can go through the haunts. You can

357
00:24:15.319 --> 00:24:18.799
go through multiple times. You do
whatever you want, and there's food and

358
00:24:18.400 --> 00:24:25.759
there's stuff to keep you up.
But in the interview specifically they the new

359
00:24:26.039 --> 00:24:30.240
GM, they're specifically talked about how
this is the model, the festival model

360
00:24:30.400 --> 00:24:34.799
is the model that they're doubling down
on. Really this as the model,

361
00:24:36.200 --> 00:24:41.400
talking about how they've added the scare
zone as something that's more light, you

362
00:24:41.440 --> 00:24:42.839
know, just not as long the
line you can just kind of water in

363
00:24:42.880 --> 00:24:48.440
and out of. Its more free
form, and that they've added these there's

364
00:24:48.480 --> 00:24:52.799
a s'mores and stories area now where
it's they converted one of their bars into

365
00:24:52.839 --> 00:24:56.039
like a s'mores area, so there's
still like an alcohol but it's basically to

366
00:24:56.079 --> 00:24:59.960
me, it seems like a mocktail
type of thing that they've added where it's

367
00:25:00.119 --> 00:25:03.160
like you can do this moores and
while this moores are going on, undead

368
00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:07.759
trigger treaters will come up and tell
you stories, and the stories kind of

369
00:25:07.839 --> 00:25:11.720
ore background to some of the attractions
around, so it's something for families to

370
00:25:11.759 --> 00:25:15.000
do when it's hang out. They
also added like a dance area, a

371
00:25:15.000 --> 00:25:19.680
pumpkin pumpkin themed dance areas where it's
really just a big party that they've added.

372
00:25:19.920 --> 00:25:25.759
So these are two very PG areas
that they've added. And then also

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00:25:25.880 --> 00:25:30.519
just to underscore that, they've decided
to keep the educational programming as part of

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00:25:30.559 --> 00:25:36.799
this, so they are offering the
twelve dollars Flashlight Tour that is a historical

375
00:25:36.839 --> 00:25:40.839
tour. They have the areas of
the museum open, so they have a

376
00:25:40.839 --> 00:25:45.759
whole section that is not fictitional,
it is history of the area. And

377
00:25:45.839 --> 00:25:51.400
I talked to her specifically about that
you just said about moving the general audience,

378
00:25:51.400 --> 00:25:52.880
and she says, they continue to
see that, they continue to see

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00:25:53.160 --> 00:25:56.880
that they are bringing in a wider
audience, and they thought that it wouldn't

380
00:25:56.960 --> 00:26:02.240
work to keep the historical pieces there, but more and more people are taking

381
00:26:02.240 --> 00:26:06.119
the audio tours, even during Halloween, and they're learning about it and then

382
00:26:06.240 --> 00:26:08.920
encourages them to come back during the
year or so. And it's funny because

383
00:26:10.200 --> 00:26:14.559
this is something that has been in
the works for quite some time, and

384
00:26:14.599 --> 00:26:18.039
I've talked to the previous team.
I don't know the current team, but

385
00:26:18.039 --> 00:26:21.200
I've talked to the previous team on
several occasions, because, as you said,

386
00:26:21.880 --> 00:26:26.920
they've been friends of ours for years, and the idea of making it

387
00:26:27.000 --> 00:26:33.839
more quote unquote theme park like it
was something that they were very excited about

388
00:26:33.839 --> 00:26:37.519
and have been for quite some time. But there was always the concern of

389
00:26:38.640 --> 00:26:47.519
there is there a danger in combining
real history with fictional history and or fictional

390
00:26:47.880 --> 00:26:52.279
experiences, and so they always wrestled
with that, and I think that you

391
00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:55.720
know the way they did it because
I was there. Not this year,

392
00:26:55.720 --> 00:26:59.240
but I was there for the very
first year of the new concept, and

393
00:26:59.599 --> 00:27:02.799
it's still some tweaks that were being
made, and all the things that you've

394
00:27:02.799 --> 00:27:06.400
said are exactly in line with what, in my opinion, should have happened

395
00:27:06.799 --> 00:27:11.519
in its evolution. But the thing
I think is interesting is they've recognized,

396
00:27:11.559 --> 00:27:15.160
you know, people are smart enough
to say, this is the real thing.

397
00:27:15.200 --> 00:27:21.839
Here's the pretend stuff, but this
is the real stuff. And I'm

398
00:27:21.920 --> 00:27:26.519
curious to see. You know,
as we've said so very many times on

399
00:27:26.559 --> 00:27:29.839
this show, everything is cyclical.
Everything is like a pendulum. It swings

400
00:27:29.880 --> 00:27:33.440
back and forth, and right now, I think we are approaching the apex

401
00:27:33.480 --> 00:27:41.599
of the family side and be something
that families can do together. I do

402
00:27:41.680 --> 00:27:45.880
think that pendulum will swing back to
the other side eventually and things will have

403
00:27:45.920 --> 00:27:48.599
to be more specific. You know. I use the phrase a lot.

404
00:27:48.599 --> 00:27:52.319
If you attempt to be all things
to everyone, then you end up being

405
00:27:52.319 --> 00:27:56.480
nothing for anyone. And I'm not
saying that's what's happening with Eastern State.

406
00:27:56.519 --> 00:28:02.759
What I'm saying is right now they're
trying to be something for families there.

407
00:28:02.759 --> 00:28:06.279
That's there, that's their focus right
now. And I have seen, like

408
00:28:06.519 --> 00:28:10.119
you know, with with Zoo Tampa
and Indianapolis Zoo, a couple of projects

409
00:28:10.119 --> 00:28:14.400
that I work on, which are
incredibly family friendly. They are they are

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00:28:14.480 --> 00:28:18.559
selling out, you know, because
they're doing they're doing reserve time ticketing and

411
00:28:18.920 --> 00:28:23.440
or some of them are, and
uh, they're they're they're having great attendance

412
00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:26.960
because they're able to bring every member
of the family out. There's a little

413
00:28:26.960 --> 00:28:33.559
something for everybody. And the only
thing I I the only cautionary tale I

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00:28:33.559 --> 00:28:41.160
throw out there is recognize that if
you only focus on things for really young

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00:28:41.279 --> 00:28:45.319
children or families with really young children, you're not hitting that full family demographic.

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00:28:45.799 --> 00:28:51.200
You need something that appeals something,
some element that appeals to the teens

417
00:28:51.200 --> 00:28:53.119
and tweens, like the machine shop
they still have there from there, yes,

418
00:28:53.119 --> 00:28:56.359
which exactly exactly. Yeah, And
I think that And I'm saying this

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00:28:56.400 --> 00:29:03.079
because I think Eastern Eastern State is
doing it right. What. Yeah,

420
00:29:03.160 --> 00:29:07.160
I think what you're saying is interesting. I think what I would add is,

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00:29:07.519 --> 00:29:11.680
I think it works in this moment
to your point, because the perceived

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00:29:11.799 --> 00:29:17.559
value is higher right now, right, It's like traditionally, or just even

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00:29:17.559 --> 00:29:22.119
look at Eastern State, you could
pay x amount thirty dollars whatever for basically

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00:29:22.119 --> 00:29:25.759
one walk through and all you would
you would just enter and you would walk

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00:29:25.759 --> 00:29:27.039
through, and then you would leave. And now it's you know, it's

426
00:29:27.079 --> 00:29:30.160
the same I don't know if it's
the same price, but say, let's

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00:29:30.160 --> 00:29:33.359
say, for sake of argument's the
same price. Comparable right, comparable price,

428
00:29:33.480 --> 00:29:37.119
But now they get to tell you
five haunts, four seemed VARs,

429
00:29:37.599 --> 00:29:38.440
and get to dance. Part of
that. You can hang out and you

430
00:29:38.480 --> 00:29:42.440
can just hang out, so you
if a family is coming or even a

431
00:29:42.440 --> 00:29:48.000
group of friends really going, they
could spend a lot longer than the first

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00:29:48.039 --> 00:29:51.960
version. So the perceived value right
now is higher. And if you're having

433
00:29:52.000 --> 00:29:56.079
to make choices because you have limited
disocial income, something that you could spend

434
00:29:56.279 --> 00:29:59.599
three two to three hours on like
a movie. You know, basically,

435
00:29:59.640 --> 00:30:03.039
I think right now, it's a
higher perci value right and well. On

436
00:30:03.079 --> 00:30:04.880
the other side of it, too, is when you create opportunities for people

437
00:30:04.880 --> 00:30:10.160
to just hang out. As you
say, when people are hanging out,

438
00:30:10.480 --> 00:30:17.279
it actually increases your culinary revenue and
may even increase your merchandise revenue because if

439
00:30:17.279 --> 00:30:19.200
people are hanging out having a good
time, if there's a bar or a

440
00:30:19.240 --> 00:30:26.079
s'morest place or whatever, that is
a minimal upcharge so that they can I

441
00:30:26.079 --> 00:30:29.079
won't say nickel and dime, but
so that they can continue to generate revenue

442
00:30:29.079 --> 00:30:32.559
within the experience. The longer you
stay, the more likely it is that

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00:30:32.599 --> 00:30:37.400
they will throw throw money at you. And there's nothing, there's nothing wrong

444
00:30:37.440 --> 00:30:41.200
with that. Speaking of time,
I would love to hang out longer.

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00:30:41.200 --> 00:30:44.480
We would love to hang out and
have another cup of coffee and continue to

446
00:30:44.559 --> 00:30:48.799
chat. However, our time is
up for today, so on behalf of

447
00:30:48.799 --> 00:30:52.880
Philipernandez with Gantum Lighting and the Haunted
Attraction Network and myself Scott Swinson with Scott

448
00:30:52.880 --> 00:30:56.880
Swinson Creative Development. This is Green
Tag Theme Park and thirty and we'll see

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00:30:56.920 --> 00:30:57.440
you next week.