July 21, 2024
Are the Country Bears just a cover band now?
Country Bear Jamboree opened last week, and features popular Disney songs from other IPs - is this world building on Disney's part, or world destruction?
Country Bear Jamboree opened last week, and features popular Disney songs from other IPs - is this world building on Disney's part, or world destruction? Also, Scott has something to say about the new Tiana's Bayou Adventure.
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WEBVTT
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Okay from our studios this week in
Orlando and Tampa. This is Green Tag
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Theme Park in thirty. I'm Philip
and I'm joined as always by my co
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host Scott Swinson of Scott Swinson Creative
Development. Scott, there's a well,
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there's some Disney news we didn't cover
in previous episodes because there was a few
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other stories to get to, but
we're going to kind of wrap it together
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this week and squish them into one's
story. We are going to squish them
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into one story. And of course
the one that just happened now is just
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last week. On July seventeenth,
the new Country Very Musical Jamboree opened at
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Magic Kingdom in Walt Disney World.
The Audio Animatronics Spectacle stars the familiar Bear
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characters in a completely new show,
now featuring songs from Disney films. Try
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everything from Zootopia, remember Me from
Coco and more so, I haven't been
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to I didn't get a chance in
this visit to get into Magic Kingdom.
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Also, who in their right minds
would want to go to Magic Kingdom in
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the middle of summer with not only
all the families, but with the like
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one hundred and seven degree heat plus
humidity. I have no idea again really
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questioning the future of Floridian theme parks
this week what I've been here, but
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I didn't get to see it,
but I have seen some videos and I
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have. Of course, the thing
that was most interesting to me as someone
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who has been you know, used
to be a cast member and whatnot in
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that area is really the shift over
to the IP songs, you know,
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from it being the bear and the
stuff that was made for the show to
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them adapting other IP songs to the
show, which is a theme that we
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have talked about that Disney has been, I think, intentionally crafting these experiences
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to reinforce their brands. Yeah,
and it's and it's interesting because I totally
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understand the idea and the need to
to bring in more contemporary brands, let's
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put it that way, then hanging
on to hanging on to the old stuff.
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But there's always going to be that
push pull when it comes to something
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like this. I mean, I
will be completely honest, Country Bear Jambree
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went because I so I visited Walt
Disney World, uh the uh well within
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the first twelve months that it was
opened. So I was, and I
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was I was young. I was
with my family and Country Bear Jamboree was
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like the coolest thing I had ever
seen in my entire life. And for
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me, you know, this this
little theater kid, pre theater kid.
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Actually I wasn't even involved in the
theatrical world yet, but this was this
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was well worth the two and a
half hour queue that we had to wait
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to go in and see it.
And it was this wonderful standalone I p
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that was you could only experience there
and loved every single moment of it.
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And in fact, I just recently
found my big al plush from from Country
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Bear Jambree that I got when I
was a child, a wee child.
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So I will tell you that there
is a part of me, there's a
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child part of me that is sad
about this because it is to me now
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the Country Bear Jamboree has shifted from
being its own entity to being a cover
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band. You know, it's it's
sort of like it's sort of like when
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when pop pop bands or pop stars
from from past eras don't quite have enough
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hits to do their own concert,
so they do covers of other people from
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the same era. That's what this
feels like to me. I now I
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have not seen it. I'm sure
it's lovely, I'm sure it's wonderful.
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I've not seen it in person.
Let me rephrase that I have. I
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have seen almost the entire show on
video now. But so as a purist,
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this is a little bit disheartening for
me to see that we are no
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longer allowing things to be unique to
the parks. We are no longer.
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But I also recognize the business side
of me also recognizes that people don't care
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about that as much. They would
much rather have the comfort food of things
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that they recognize and things they especially
music that they can sing along with.
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So I get that as well.
To me, this is it is.
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It is less of it's less of
its own attraction and is now a commercial
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for other Disney music, and that, like I said, that kind of
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breaks my heart a little bit.
But I also recognize that things need to
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continue to move forward and if this
is what the current audiences want, I
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will say the decision I'm guessing the
decision to change it was not because this
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is what the current audiences want.
My guess is this looked really good on
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paper when it was being decided.
And I'm not commenting on its execution because
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I really don't know what the guests
are saying, but I think it's important
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to recognize. I mean, this
is what's happened throughout Epcot as well.
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Is you know Epcot originally like going
to different countries around the world, or
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significantly more like going to different countries
around the world, and now it's like
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going to different countries around the world. If they were at Disney. So
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if if all of a sudden,
Norway was purchased by Disney, and you
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know, the national anthem becomes a
song from Frozen, you know that's it's
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kind of where they've gone. So
to me, it is it is intelligent
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in the fact that it's embracing all
of their other iyps, but disappointing to
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me because they're not embracing the park
as an ip unto itself and and that
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saddens me just a little bit.
So I don't know, you're you have
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a you have a different perspective on
this, I think, Philip, So,
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how how do you feel about this? It's the wrong person saying the
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wrong songs to me. Yeah,
it's a cover band. Yeah, now
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you're in Country Bear Jamber into a
cover band. But I I think I
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actually agree with everything that you said. I'm wondering if you think that we're
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going to if this is ever going
to swing back in the other direction,
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because it's taken a while to get
here. I think you know originally right,
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some of these concepts date back to
Walt himself, you know, kind
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of wanting. I think if you
think about it, also, you want
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the attraction to stand on its own
as an attraction, you know, like
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when you go into this attraction,
you don't have to have any exterior knowledge.
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But the Dizney of today is looking
at world building. Basically, they
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want to build an empire. They
want to build a whole universe that you
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just live inside of and it doesn't
really nod itself to anything happening outside of
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it. You know, everything is
within their universe. It doesn't it doesn't
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talk to the other pieces of it. But I think if you know,
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then I think you know, even
if it is a cover band, again,
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if you're not familiar with some of
those songs or what I don't know,
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I to me, it actually does
get old to me. I prefer
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it that the ride it is entertaining
in of itself, that it makes sense
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in of itself, and I think
that it starts to lose coherency a little
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bit when you're like, well,
why are they bears? Like why would
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they choose remember Me from Cocotas?
Doesn't make any sense? You know,
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you're kind of June, You're kind
of just there are questions you're asking that
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don't make any sense versus you know, the original ride. It all made
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a lot of sense and it fit
in the theming and it was good.
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So I don't know. Do you
think the pendulum is going to swing back
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at some point or do you think
it won't matter for Disney because now they're
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so strong. Like when Walt was
making it, it had to stand on
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its own because they didn't have an
empire, and now they have an empire.
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It doesn't matter and it's never going
to swing back. Well to me,
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it's like to me, it's like
if if Country Bear, if the
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Country Bear Jamboree. To me,
it's no different. It's the same feeling
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I had. That's kind of like
fingernails on the chalk word when all of
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a sudden they put Jack Skellington into
the Haunted Mansion. Yeah, and so
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it used to And what I think
is interesting is the the rides. When
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the rides were designed or the attractions
were designed to stand alone in the in
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the live properties, they built up
enough brand that you could actually create movies
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from them. I mean, Pirates
of the Caribbean became this huge film success,
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as did you know, as did
Well didn't become success, But films
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were made of Haunted Mansion and Country
Bear Jamboree. So it's one of those.
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Now they're integrating. I don't know, it just seems it seems like
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ill placed sponsorship. Does that make
sense. It'd be like the Country Bear
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Jamboree singing and then all of a
sudden stopping and going and don't forget to
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have a good old mountain dew because
that's going to quench your thirst. Like
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you know, it just seems like
you talk about world building. To me,
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it's world destruction. To me.
It is it is tearing down the
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world that we've built of the Country
Bear Jamboree. Now, someone can come
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back and say, yeah, but
they could have heard these songs, and
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my response is where did they go
to the movies? You know? They
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do they have do they have do
they have an Apple Music account? Do
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the Country Bears from Country Bear Jamboree. Actually you know stream livestream music.
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Maybe they do, but it just
seems to me it seems like they're muddying
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the brand as opposed to reinforcing it. But at the same time, I
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do recognize that if you're going there
with your kids, the kids are going
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to want to be able to sing
along with songs, and that's not going
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to be that's not going to be
the traditional folk music that you know fits
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with that area. It's going to
be country Bear Jamboree versions of Disney tunes
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that they know from other films.
So I don't know, will it swing
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back, I don't I don't know. I don't know. What I'm hoping
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doesn't happen is that it doesn't get
into some of the areas that they've really
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done beautiful work in creating worlds.
You know, when all of a sudden,
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when all of a sudden, Job
of the Hut starts singing you remember
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me from Coco. Uh, that's
where it's gone too far, I think.
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But yeah, gosh, we joke
about it. Now come back like
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next year or you know, got
this watch this D twenty three. They're
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like, oh and and now announcing. Yes, the the job of the
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Hut sings Disney tunes from the nineties. You know, no they or they
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they do the they do that whole
you know, the whole Star Wars pub
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But it's it's Disney songs they're playing. You know, remember me, They're
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playing Oh no, oh, my
gosh. Okay, Anyway, on that
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note, let's the second story that
we didn't talk about when it came out,
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But of course it's the same concept. Of course is the Tiana's Value
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Adventure, which is the re skin
of course of Splash Mountain, which came
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out. It's been open for a
while now, we just didn't have a
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chance to talk about it. But
I think it's the same concept. It's
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really just taking you know this this
with taking a story and you were changing
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it out, but maybe with a
twist in this case because the ride has
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a history. It does have a
history. I want to read what I
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thought was a pretty good thesis statement. Actually this is coming from theme park
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insider Robert over there, who's always
does a great reporting, and I'm going
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to read his He says quote here, Disney did not need a change Splash
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Mountain, the Flume ride remained popular
with fans thirty years after its debut at
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Disneyland in California, but rides themes. But ride's theme emerged from a racist
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dog whistle, and Disney leadership decided
that they did not wish to be associated
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with that any longer. In doing
so, Disney risk provoking the wrath of
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the countless fans who love Splash Mountain
all to right or wrong that most of
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the fans did not and could not
see. It's We'll link to the full
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column in the show notes because I
think it's a great column. It goes
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as as Robert always does. It
is excellent reporting. It goes through the
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history of the ride and really talks
about how you know, in his opinion
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that Disney always knew that it arose
from racist origins, and they you know,
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kind of of course, you know, you're you're balancing to perspectives,
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you know, the writer's perspective and
his history on the ride. But then
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we don't actually know what we know
what Disney thinks. It's kind of his
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opinion of what Disney has thought.
But Disney's never made a statement about the
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origins one way or the other.
You know, Disney was just saying kind
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of making it seem like it was
similar to the country very jambris right.
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They're like, we're refreshing the ride
to keep innovating and forward and blah blah,
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and then put Tiana in in celebration. You know. Of course,
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Disney's never gonna say anything about that. The reception, since it's been open
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for a month, I will say
the reception has been mixed, as it
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always is with anything that Disney does, it is always mixed. You have
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plenty of people who are happy that
Tiana has a ride, and they're happy
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to see it transformed, because you
see plenty of people that were, you
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know, always concerned about the ride. But you have an equal amount of
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people are upset that the ride has
changed. And I think some of those
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people fall into two camps. You
know, some that are unhappy it changed
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at all, especially changed into Tiana
versus what it was. And then some
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people who are just always unhappy whenever
Disney changes anything that gets away from the
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core you know, stories that they
imagine, and they see Splash Mountin as
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one of the core stories that has
been you know, changed, so they're
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not happy with that. So it's
the mister Toad wild mister Toad's wild Ride
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concept that it's like, how dare
you change yes? Don't change yes?
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Yes, it sounds like me.
That's usually me. I'm usually the cranky
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old guy who's like, don't change
it. It's tradition. However, in
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this particular situation, I actually so
I have a unique I'm gonna I'm gonna
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share some some views here, and
I'm gonna share them because I'm I'm gonna
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take it completely out of this story. But I will come back. I
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promise. This is not a rabbit
hole that I'm going to go down.
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Uh So, when I get when
I get bored and just want noise in
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the background, I will turn on
on roqu Wu, I'll turn on Buzzer,
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which is all of the old game
shows. And some of the stuff
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that they said on old game shows
was so is so cringey because in the
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in the seventies and early eighties,
the treatment of women, the treatment of
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different ethnic backgrounds, the treatment of
different races was viewed very differently. And
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the things that they said that were
humorous and funny and god uproarious laughs.
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Today you listen to them and you
just kind of go to me, this
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is what Splash Mountain was. Splash
Mountain was one of those things that in
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its in its day, there where
people who who just fell in love with
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it because it was like, oh, look how charming and lovable these stories
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are and these characters are, and
they are they're wonderful. They're wonderful characters,
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but they are characters that come out
of come out of well, the
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American history of slavery, and it's
not you know, let's face it,
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there is a question. There is
a character called the tar Baby. Let's
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think about that for just a fleeting
moment. Okay, we're done. So
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there is a there is a racist
There is a racist overlay in here.
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And you know, did Disney know
it was racist? I don't. I
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don't. Here's the thing. I
don't think it's considered racist when it was
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originally conceived, correct. I think
it was considered culturally appropriate. But we
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have moved on and I think this
change is is the right thing to do.
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I think, you know now that
that little girls of color can can
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see themselves in a Disney princess in
a major attraction is exactly the right way
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to go. And now this is
my opinion as an old white guy.
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So I'm hoping. I'm hoping.
I'm not offending anyone. That's not my
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intent, nor am I trying to
put words in people's mouths. But I
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think this is the right way to
go. I think it is in what
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I have studied and continue to try
to learn about DEI. It is a
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journey, not a destination. So
I think this is a step in the
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right direction. I think we're following
the right roadmap and taking something that represents
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a in my opinion, a darker
time in American history and flipping it on
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its head so that it shows better
representation of people who don't look like me.
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And I think that's I think that's
important and certainly a step in the
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right direction. Yeah, to me, this is you know, I know,
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you said it's similar to the the
Country Bear Jamboree. To me,
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this is taking one world and discarding
it to bring in a new world,
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as opposed to cross cross pollinating worlds
like Country Bear Jamboree is doing. Yeah,
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you're right, because they they really
did remove all of the remove everything
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from the original, and they're they're
putting in a whole new world that already
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has a whole ethos I mean,
there's the movie. I mean, it
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has a whole Tiana is a presence
and bringing Tiana into it and placing it
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in there, and and interestingly enough, you know, for me personally,
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when when Song of the South came
out, I saw that as a very
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as a wee child. So that
is the film that I identify with.
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I do not identify with with Tiana. But I'm also not the target audience
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for this either. And I also
want to make certain that you know,
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there's there's plenty of things that that
I saw as a child growing up that
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I I could say that's me,
you know, That's what I want to
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be, That's what I want to
aspire to. And this opens up that
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door for a whole bunch of people
who, in my in my opinion,
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have been underrepresented. And I think
it's I think it is a very very
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good move on Disney's behalf I I
think I will say, you know,
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and Philip and I were talking a
little bit before we started recording. I
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do take a little bit of issue
taking taking the words out of context because
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I have not read the full the
full article that that that Philip was just
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quoting. I have skimmed it and
I see, I see where he's coming
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from. He's coming from a place
that is is, as you say,
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excellent reporting. But I I want
to be careful of the phrase the uh
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where is it all to right or
wrong? That most that most fans did
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not and could not see Well,
if they could not see it, then
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they weren't looking very closely, in
my opinion. And and you know,
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was it a fun ride that everybody
just kind of glossed over and went yeah,
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Well that to me, that is
the most dangerous kind of racism.
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Is that the kind of racism that
is disguised as something that is just fun
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and fluffy. Oh, look it's
about it's about a rabbit and a bear,
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and and look how cute that is, while reinforcing the ideas of slavery.
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And so I think this is I
think this is exactly the right thing
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to do. That's That's what I'm
trying to say. And I and I
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and I applaud Disney for making this
and for those people who are unwilling or
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unable to accept this change, I'm
sorry, but but I think that you
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know, it's the same thing people
would say to me about what do you
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mean you're taking to what you're having
them saying. Remember me in country Bear
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Jamboree. I'm going to say the
same thing too. What do you mean
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you you don't feel comfortable with Tiana
taking over Splash Mountain. So we all
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have our own we all have our
own biases, we all have our own
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microbiases, and we all have our
own preferences, and I think the important
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thing is to recognize that they're not
always cut and dried, and we need
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to embrace and make sure that what
we are indeed seeing and what we are
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indeed saying are what we really want
to say and see. Does that make
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sense? Yes, I don't really
have much to add. I think I'm
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mostly in agreement with everything, so
I don't want to belabor it too much.
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I think we can move on.
But let's talk business, Philip,
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Let's talk Yeah, I think story
coming up. I do agree overall,
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I think it's a it's a good
change, and I the only thing I
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would I would say is even though
a thing is popular, that doesn't mean
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it doesn't need to be innovated,
And so that would be my only you
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know, throw everything else out the
window. But even and then, you
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know, just because the thing is
popular now doesn't mean it's not future proofed.
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That's all what you know, especially
with us with manufacturing and even you
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know, that's always the dance that
we run with even our lighting fixtures.
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It's like, you know, we
have some that are our bread and butter,
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and you know, there's always that
resistance. There's always you're like,
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you want to keep it going because
it's your bread and butter. But then
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you have to think three, five, and ten years down the road at
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each of those points and say,
is it still going to be the best
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in those at those times, and
you know you have to start preparing,
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you know, And it's always it
always causes friction even in what we do.
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When you you know, I laugh
because like we have made our fixtures
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better, but it still upsets people. And you know, you're like,
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why are you up? Like it's
literally better, it's a better light,
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it's more value for you. Everything
is easier for you, and they're still
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upset because they have to change the
number on their piece of paper. Then
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they can't be bothered. It's also
because they now have to learn how to
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utilize the new equipment and they but
but again here you just have to process
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new stories you know, because they
could have. I mean, they could
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have. If they wanted to just
innovate Splash Mountain, they could have.
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They could have, you know,
they could have just renovated. Yeah.
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Well, the South has a ton
of stories that are that weren't represented.
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In fact, it only represents one
or two of the stories that are in
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Song of the South, So if
they wanted to upgrade it and keep the
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same story, they could have.
But I think they took a good opportunity.
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And you know, we were talking
earlier about we didn't know whether it
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was whether the change was done because
of the racist overtones of the of the
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previous story or because the ride needed
to be upgraded. But I don't care,
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because if the ride needed to be
upgraded, they could have just upgraded
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it with the same story, and
they didn't, So I think that's the
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right choice. Yeah, Okay,
moving on. Tait has announced that the
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private equity business at Goldman Sachs Alternatives
will acquire a majority stake in the company
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from affiliates of Providence Equity Partners,
subject to obtaining customary regulatory approvals. Financial
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details of the transaction were not disclosed, so that's basically the entire story.
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There's more in there. I mean, obviously, you know, if you
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know Sacks and you know Taate blah
blah blah, Tay is a big player
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in the entertainment design. I think
Scott and I have both come across them
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in different roles across our career in
the industry, so they are they have
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far reaching impact out there. I
think most consumers would recognize something they have
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built, for sure if you've been
in theme parks. So it's a pretty
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big it's a pretty big, long
reaching firm, and you know, I
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don't know if it's typical, but
yeah, we don't know anything else about
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it. But to me, it
does signal something that we have been talking
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about kind of I don't want to
say agnosiam but kind of in periphery for
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a while. Is that, you
know, if you look at the six
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Flag story we've talked about previously,
the big merger, you see there's a
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lot of interest there. Essentially,
what we've talked about for a while is
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the concept of you know, you
have these big companies that are vying over
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third place essentially in the streaming wars, which leads back to content and understanding
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how important content and live entertainment and
all that thing is. And so we
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know that Disney and Universal are up
there, and then we see that you
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know, this merger is hopefully going
to secure six flags. I think their
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plan at least is to make them
the third third thing. And then you
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know, Disney and so also control
their pieces of streaming, and so we'll
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see who the third streaming person is. But I think all this is clear
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that there is a tension for how
profitable a live entertainment division can be.
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And I think everybody is looking at
Disney, and I think the same thing
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we have talked about. They're looking
at Disney at their earnings and they are
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saying, well, if you take
streaming aside out of the Disney Company,
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these earnings are really good for things
entertainment. So there might be something to
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this. And talking about the future
proofing that we were just talking about,
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it's pretty future proof because there's not
you know, in the next few years,
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there's not going to be robots that
are going to be you know,
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I mean, there's it's live human
connection is going to be something that is
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pretty future proof from AI. It's
not gonna you know, it's pretty it's
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pretty future proofd and then when you
combine that with ips like we've been talking
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about, it's a really good business
model. So I'm not surprised at all
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that you see suddenly interest in investing
in these things. But I think it
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all comes back to what we also
talked about previously, which as which is
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one does not simply build a theme
park. It is not, you know,
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I think Wall Street. I think
sometimes Wall Street is a great predictive
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engine, but that doesn't mean they
understand the nuances of every industry. And
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I do think that same with Netflix. You know, it's not you know,
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one does not simply build a theme
park Netflix. It's not going to
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be easy to make a Disney park. You know. The reason that Disney
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that with everything we've been talking about, all this world and the I and
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all this crazy things. I mean, that is how Disney is able to
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be so profitable at this and so
you do not do that overnight, regardless
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of how much money Wall Street throws
at you. So that's money. Thank
359
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you for coming to me about that. And the thing I think is interesting
360
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is, you know, we when
we first started doing this show back in
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the Dark Ages, when we first
started doing this show, both Philip and
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I were concerned about the future of
theme park in general because it was you
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know, it was during COVID,
it was you know, we've done and
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and we were like, what's gonna
happen. What's gonna happen to me?
365
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Having a company like Golden Sax,
which is not and it's it is Golden
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Sex Alternatives, but still which is
not necessarily in the trenches when it comes
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to live entertainment. The fact that
they are interested and see value in owning
368
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the majority of shares in Tate because
Tate does you know, when Philip said,
369
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uh, you you all know things
that Tate's been involved in, that
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is true on so many levels,
because it's not just theme park. It's
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concerts, it's event production, it's
you know, uh, have you ever
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watched a Super Bowl? You know, it's it's all that kind of stuff.
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But it's all somehow entertainment or entertainment
adjacent. And if a company outside
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of the entertainment industry is willing and
interested and sees profitability in investing a company
375
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investing in a company that does this
kind of thing and does it on a
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grand scale, to me, that
more than anything, that shows that people
377
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who are much smarter than I am
when it comes to finances. See that
378
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there is a recovery here, and
see that there is a takeoff. And
379
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I will say it is not just
in the US, because you know,
380
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having having worked for a Tate subsidiary, a lot of what they do is
381
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you'll you'll probably never see if you're
an American life because it's they're doing a
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lot of work in the Middle East, they're doing a lot of they did
383
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a lot of work in China,
so they're doing a lot of international and
384
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they see international growth, you know, like with Jea's twenty thirty project in
385
00:28:14.559 --> 00:28:18.400
Saudi Arabia, for example, they
want they want to become a leader in
386
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the entertainment world in Saudi Arabia by
twenty thirty, and so that means they're
387
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going to be building gigantic theme parks. That means they're going to be basically
388
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creating an entertainment industry in their country, and they need somebody who knows how
389
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to do it, like a Taate
or a think Well, which is a
390
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Tape property. So Golden Saxis is
looking at this looking forward, going well,
391
00:28:42.680 --> 00:28:48.400
gosh, there's a lot of opportunity
here. We should probably get at
392
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least some stock here, and the
fact that they're going for controlling stock is
393
00:28:52.680 --> 00:28:56.440
very interesting. It's very interesting.
So to me, that is a very
394
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positive sign for our industry. Is
there I actually don't know this. I'm
395
00:29:02.599 --> 00:29:06.279
not sure that you sound Scott.
I think the difference would be Tait is
396
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not in the operations, right,
so it's really just the fabrication and the
397
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building. I mean, I guess
operations if it were a temporary thing like
398
00:29:17.160 --> 00:29:21.160
a concert or whatnot, but not
not like they're not staffed, like they're
399
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not running theme parks. They're not
staffing them. They're not like, no,
400
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they they go for the I always
like to say they're they're in the
401
00:29:26.039 --> 00:29:32.720
business of going from from nothing to
something huge. So it's that's what they
402
00:29:33.039 --> 00:29:37.240
that's what they So during this this
market where things are expanding, things are
403
00:29:37.279 --> 00:29:44.000
being built, things are explosively growing, that's where companies like Tate And again
404
00:29:44.079 --> 00:29:45.200
I am not a Tait expert.
I'm not even going to pretend to be,
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but companies like Tate, that's where
they thrive is in that as things
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start to expand, in that expansive
nature of the theme park an attractions industry
407
00:29:59.799 --> 00:30:04.359
and Golden Sacks obviously sees that and
like I said, much smarter when it
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comes to money than I am.
So they see that are investing in that,
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and to me, that is a
very good sign for our industry.
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And I think another good sign for
our industry is the fact that Philip and
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I get together and talk about it
every single week. But unfortunately we're done
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for this week, and because we're
we're out of time. So let's keep
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the industry going, and more importantly
to me personally, let's keep this show
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going. So please join us again
next week for Green Tag Theme Park in
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00:30:30.880 --> 00:30:34.920
thirty on behalf of Philip Hernandez and
myself Scott Swinson. We will see you
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next week.
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Okay from our studios this week in
Orlando and Tampa. This is Green Tag
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00:00:06.440 --> 00:00:09.599
Theme Park in thirty. I'm Philip
and I'm joined as always by my co
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00:00:09.679 --> 00:00:15.759
host Scott Swinson of Scott Swinson Creative
Development. Scott, there's a well,
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there's some Disney news we didn't cover
in previous episodes because there was a few
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00:00:20.359 --> 00:00:23.079
other stories to get to, but
we're going to kind of wrap it together
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this week and squish them into one's
story. We are going to squish them
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into one story. And of course
the one that just happened now is just
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last week. On July seventeenth,
the new Country Very Musical Jamboree opened at
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Magic Kingdom in Walt Disney World.
The Audio Animatronics Spectacle stars the familiar Bear
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characters in a completely new show,
now featuring songs from Disney films. Try
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everything from Zootopia, remember Me from
Coco and more so, I haven't been
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to I didn't get a chance in
this visit to get into Magic Kingdom.
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Also, who in their right minds
would want to go to Magic Kingdom in
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the middle of summer with not only
all the families, but with the like
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one hundred and seven degree heat plus
humidity. I have no idea again really
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questioning the future of Floridian theme parks
this week what I've been here, but
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I didn't get to see it,
but I have seen some videos and I
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have. Of course, the thing
that was most interesting to me as someone
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who has been you know, used
to be a cast member and whatnot in
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that area is really the shift over
to the IP songs, you know,
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from it being the bear and the
stuff that was made for the show to
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them adapting other IP songs to the
show, which is a theme that we
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have talked about that Disney has been, I think, intentionally crafting these experiences
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to reinforce their brands. Yeah,
and it's and it's interesting because I totally
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understand the idea and the need to
to bring in more contemporary brands, let's
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put it that way, then hanging
on to hanging on to the old stuff.
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But there's always going to be that
push pull when it comes to something
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like this. I mean, I
will be completely honest, Country Bear Jambree
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went because I so I visited Walt
Disney World, uh the uh well within
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the first twelve months that it was
opened. So I was, and I
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was I was young. I was
with my family and Country Bear Jamboree was
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like the coolest thing I had ever
seen in my entire life. And for
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me, you know, this this
little theater kid, pre theater kid.
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Actually I wasn't even involved in the
theatrical world yet, but this was this
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was well worth the two and a
half hour queue that we had to wait
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to go in and see it.
And it was this wonderful standalone I p
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that was you could only experience there
and loved every single moment of it.
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And in fact, I just recently
found my big al plush from from Country
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Bear Jambree that I got when I
was a child, a wee child.
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So I will tell you that there
is a part of me, there's a
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child part of me that is sad
about this because it is to me now
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the Country Bear Jamboree has shifted from
being its own entity to being a cover
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band. You know, it's it's
sort of like it's sort of like when
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when pop pop bands or pop stars
from from past eras don't quite have enough
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hits to do their own concert,
so they do covers of other people from
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the same era. That's what this
feels like to me. I now I
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have not seen it. I'm sure
it's lovely, I'm sure it's wonderful.
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I've not seen it in person.
Let me rephrase that I have. I
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have seen almost the entire show on
video now. But so as a purist,
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this is a little bit disheartening for
me to see that we are no
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longer allowing things to be unique to
the parks. We are no longer.
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But I also recognize the business side
of me also recognizes that people don't care
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about that as much. They would
much rather have the comfort food of things
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that they recognize and things they especially
music that they can sing along with.
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So I get that as well.
To me, this is it is.
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It is less of it's less of
its own attraction and is now a commercial
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for other Disney music, and that, like I said, that kind of
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breaks my heart a little bit.
But I also recognize that things need to
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continue to move forward and if this
is what the current audiences want, I
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will say the decision I'm guessing the
decision to change it was not because this
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is what the current audiences want.
My guess is this looked really good on
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paper when it was being decided.
And I'm not commenting on its execution because
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I really don't know what the guests
are saying, but I think it's important
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to recognize. I mean, this
is what's happened throughout Epcot as well.
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Is you know Epcot originally like going
to different countries around the world, or
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significantly more like going to different countries
around the world, and now it's like
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going to different countries around the world. If they were at Disney. So
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if if all of a sudden,
Norway was purchased by Disney, and you
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know, the national anthem becomes a
song from Frozen, you know that's it's
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kind of where they've gone. So
to me, it is it is intelligent
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in the fact that it's embracing all
of their other iyps, but disappointing to
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me because they're not embracing the park
as an ip unto itself and and that
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saddens me just a little bit.
So I don't know, you're you have
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a you have a different perspective on
this, I think, Philip, So,
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how how do you feel about this? It's the wrong person saying the
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wrong songs to me. Yeah,
it's a cover band. Yeah, now
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you're in Country Bear Jamber into a
cover band. But I I think I
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actually agree with everything that you said. I'm wondering if you think that we're
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going to if this is ever going
to swing back in the other direction,
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because it's taken a while to get
here. I think you know originally right,
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some of these concepts date back to
Walt himself, you know, kind
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of wanting. I think if you
think about it, also, you want
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the attraction to stand on its own
as an attraction, you know, like
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when you go into this attraction,
you don't have to have any exterior knowledge.
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But the Dizney of today is looking
at world building. Basically, they
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want to build an empire. They
want to build a whole universe that you
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just live inside of and it doesn't
really nod itself to anything happening outside of
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it. You know, everything is
within their universe. It doesn't it doesn't
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talk to the other pieces of it. But I think if you know,
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then I think you know, even
if it is a cover band, again,
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if you're not familiar with some of
those songs or what I don't know,
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I to me, it actually does
get old to me. I prefer
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it that the ride it is entertaining
in of itself, that it makes sense
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in of itself, and I think
that it starts to lose coherency a little
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bit when you're like, well,
why are they bears? Like why would
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they choose remember Me from Cocotas?
Doesn't make any sense? You know,
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you're kind of June, You're kind
of just there are questions you're asking that
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don't make any sense versus you know, the original ride. It all made
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a lot of sense and it fit
in the theming and it was good.
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So I don't know. Do you
think the pendulum is going to swing back
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at some point or do you think
it won't matter for Disney because now they're
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so strong. Like when Walt was
making it, it had to stand on
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its own because they didn't have an
empire, and now they have an empire.
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It doesn't matter and it's never going
to swing back. Well to me,
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it's like to me, it's like
if if Country Bear, if the
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Country Bear Jamboree. To me,
it's no different. It's the same feeling
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I had. That's kind of like
fingernails on the chalk word when all of
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a sudden they put Jack Skellington into
the Haunted Mansion. Yeah, and so
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it used to And what I think
is interesting is the the rides. When
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the rides were designed or the attractions
were designed to stand alone in the in
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the live properties, they built up
enough brand that you could actually create movies
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from them. I mean, Pirates
of the Caribbean became this huge film success,
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as did you know, as did
Well didn't become success, But films
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were made of Haunted Mansion and Country
Bear Jamboree. So it's one of those.
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Now they're integrating. I don't know, it just seems it seems like
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ill placed sponsorship. Does that make
sense. It'd be like the Country Bear
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Jamboree singing and then all of a
sudden stopping and going and don't forget to
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have a good old mountain dew because
that's going to quench your thirst. Like
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you know, it just seems like
you talk about world building. To me,
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it's world destruction. To me.
It is it is tearing down the
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world that we've built of the Country
Bear Jamboree. Now, someone can come
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back and say, yeah, but
they could have heard these songs, and
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my response is where did they go
to the movies? You know? They
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do they have do they have do
they have an Apple Music account? Do
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the Country Bears from Country Bear Jamboree. Actually you know stream livestream music.
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Maybe they do, but it just
seems to me it seems like they're muddying
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the brand as opposed to reinforcing it. But at the same time, I
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do recognize that if you're going there
with your kids, the kids are going
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to want to be able to sing
along with songs, and that's not going
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to be that's not going to be
the traditional folk music that you know fits
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with that area. It's going to
be country Bear Jamboree versions of Disney tunes
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that they know from other films.
So I don't know, will it swing
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back, I don't I don't know. I don't know. What I'm hoping
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doesn't happen is that it doesn't get
into some of the areas that they've really
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done beautiful work in creating worlds.
You know, when all of a sudden,
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when all of a sudden, Job
of the Hut starts singing you remember
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me from Coco. Uh, that's
where it's gone too far, I think.
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But yeah, gosh, we joke
about it. Now come back like
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next year or you know, got
this watch this D twenty three. They're
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like, oh and and now announcing. Yes, the the job of the
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Hut sings Disney tunes from the nineties. You know, no they or they
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they do the they do that whole
you know, the whole Star Wars pub
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But it's it's Disney songs they're playing. You know, remember me, They're
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playing Oh no, oh, my
gosh. Okay, Anyway, on that
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note, let's the second story that
we didn't talk about when it came out,
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But of course it's the same concept. Of course is the Tiana's Value
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Adventure, which is the re skin
of course of Splash Mountain, which came
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out. It's been open for a
while now, we just didn't have a
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chance to talk about it. But
I think it's the same concept. It's
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really just taking you know this this
with taking a story and you were changing
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it out, but maybe with a
twist in this case because the ride has
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a history. It does have a
history. I want to read what I
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thought was a pretty good thesis statement. Actually this is coming from theme park
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insider Robert over there, who's always
does a great reporting, and I'm going
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to read his He says quote here, Disney did not need a change Splash
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Mountain, the Flume ride remained popular
with fans thirty years after its debut at
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Disneyland in California, but rides themes. But ride's theme emerged from a racist
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dog whistle, and Disney leadership decided
that they did not wish to be associated
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with that any longer. In doing
so, Disney risk provoking the wrath of
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the countless fans who love Splash Mountain
all to right or wrong that most of
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the fans did not and could not
see. It's We'll link to the full
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column in the show notes because I
think it's a great column. It goes
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as as Robert always does. It
is excellent reporting. It goes through the
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history of the ride and really talks
about how you know, in his opinion
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that Disney always knew that it arose
from racist origins, and they you know,
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kind of of course, you know, you're you're balancing to perspectives,
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you know, the writer's perspective and
his history on the ride. But then
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we don't actually know what we know
what Disney thinks. It's kind of his
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opinion of what Disney has thought.
But Disney's never made a statement about the
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origins one way or the other.
You know, Disney was just saying kind
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of making it seem like it was
similar to the country very jambris right.
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They're like, we're refreshing the ride
to keep innovating and forward and blah blah,
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and then put Tiana in in celebration. You know. Of course,
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Disney's never gonna say anything about that. The reception, since it's been open
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for a month, I will say
the reception has been mixed, as it
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always is with anything that Disney does, it is always mixed. You have
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plenty of people who are happy that
Tiana has a ride, and they're happy
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to see it transformed, because you
see plenty of people that were, you
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know, always concerned about the ride. But you have an equal amount of
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people are upset that the ride has
changed. And I think some of those
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people fall into two camps. You
know, some that are unhappy it changed
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at all, especially changed into Tiana
versus what it was. And then some
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people who are just always unhappy whenever
Disney changes anything that gets away from the
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core you know, stories that they
imagine, and they see Splash Mountin as
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one of the core stories that has
been you know, changed, so they're
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not happy with that. So it's
the mister Toad wild mister Toad's wild Ride
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concept that it's like, how dare
you change yes? Don't change yes?
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Yes, it sounds like me.
That's usually me. I'm usually the cranky
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old guy who's like, don't change
it. It's tradition. However, in
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this particular situation, I actually so
I have a unique I'm gonna I'm gonna
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share some some views here, and
I'm gonna share them because I'm I'm gonna
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take it completely out of this story. But I will come back. I
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promise. This is not a rabbit
hole that I'm going to go down.
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Uh So, when I get when
I get bored and just want noise in
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the background, I will turn on
on roqu Wu, I'll turn on Buzzer,
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which is all of the old game
shows. And some of the stuff
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that they said on old game shows
was so is so cringey because in the
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in the seventies and early eighties,
the treatment of women, the treatment of
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different ethnic backgrounds, the treatment of
different races was viewed very differently. And
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the things that they said that were
humorous and funny and god uproarious laughs.
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Today you listen to them and you
just kind of go to me, this
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is what Splash Mountain was. Splash
Mountain was one of those things that in
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its in its day, there where
people who who just fell in love with
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it because it was like, oh, look how charming and lovable these stories
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are and these characters are, and
they are they're wonderful. They're wonderful characters,
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but they are characters that come out
of come out of well, the
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American history of slavery, and it's
not you know, let's face it,
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there is a question. There is
a character called the tar Baby. Let's
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think about that for just a fleeting
moment. Okay, we're done. So
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there is a there is a racist
There is a racist overlay in here.
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And you know, did Disney know
it was racist? I don't. I
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don't. Here's the thing. I
don't think it's considered racist when it was
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originally conceived, correct. I think
it was considered culturally appropriate. But we
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have moved on and I think this
change is is the right thing to do.
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I think, you know now that
that little girls of color can can
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see themselves in a Disney princess in
a major attraction is exactly the right way
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to go. And now this is
my opinion as an old white guy.
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So I'm hoping. I'm hoping.
I'm not offending anyone. That's not my
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intent, nor am I trying to
put words in people's mouths. But I
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think this is the right way to
go. I think it is in what
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I have studied and continue to try
to learn about DEI. It is a
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journey, not a destination. So
I think this is a step in the
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right direction. I think we're following
the right roadmap and taking something that represents
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a in my opinion, a darker
time in American history and flipping it on
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its head so that it shows better
representation of people who don't look like me.
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And I think that's I think that's
important and certainly a step in the
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right direction. Yeah, to me, this is you know, I know,
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you said it's similar to the the
Country Bear Jamboree. To me,
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this is taking one world and discarding
it to bring in a new world,
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as opposed to cross cross pollinating worlds
like Country Bear Jamboree is doing. Yeah,
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you're right, because they they really
did remove all of the remove everything
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from the original, and they're they're
putting in a whole new world that already
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has a whole ethos I mean,
there's the movie. I mean, it
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has a whole Tiana is a presence
and bringing Tiana into it and placing it
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in there, and and interestingly enough, you know, for me personally,
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when when Song of the South came
out, I saw that as a very
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as a wee child. So that
is the film that I identify with.
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I do not identify with with Tiana. But I'm also not the target audience
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for this either. And I also
want to make certain that you know,
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there's there's plenty of things that that
I saw as a child growing up that
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I I could say that's me,
you know, That's what I want to
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be, That's what I want to
aspire to. And this opens up that
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door for a whole bunch of people
who, in my in my opinion,
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have been underrepresented. And I think
it's I think it is a very very
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good move on Disney's behalf I I
think I will say, you know,
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and Philip and I were talking a
little bit before we started recording. I
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do take a little bit of issue
taking taking the words out of context because
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I have not read the full the
full article that that that Philip was just
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quoting. I have skimmed it and
I see, I see where he's coming
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from. He's coming from a place
that is is, as you say,
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excellent reporting. But I I want
to be careful of the phrase the uh
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where is it all to right or
wrong? That most that most fans did
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not and could not see Well,
if they could not see it, then
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they weren't looking very closely, in
my opinion. And and you know,
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was it a fun ride that everybody
just kind of glossed over and went yeah,
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Well that to me, that is
the most dangerous kind of racism.
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Is that the kind of racism that
is disguised as something that is just fun
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and fluffy. Oh, look it's
about it's about a rabbit and a bear,
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and and look how cute that is, while reinforcing the ideas of slavery.
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And so I think this is I
think this is exactly the right thing
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to do. That's That's what I'm
trying to say. And I and I
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and I applaud Disney for making this
and for those people who are unwilling or
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unable to accept this change, I'm
sorry, but but I think that you
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know, it's the same thing people
would say to me about what do you
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mean you're taking to what you're having
them saying. Remember me in country Bear
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Jamboree. I'm going to say the
same thing too. What do you mean
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you you don't feel comfortable with Tiana
taking over Splash Mountain. So we all
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have our own we all have our
own biases, we all have our own
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microbiases, and we all have our
own preferences, and I think the important
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thing is to recognize that they're not
always cut and dried, and we need
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to embrace and make sure that what
we are indeed seeing and what we are
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indeed saying are what we really want
to say and see. Does that make
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sense? Yes, I don't really
have much to add. I think I'm
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mostly in agreement with everything, so
I don't want to belabor it too much.
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I think we can move on.
But let's talk business, Philip,
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Let's talk Yeah, I think story
coming up. I do agree overall,
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I think it's a it's a good
change, and I the only thing I
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would I would say is even though
a thing is popular, that doesn't mean
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it doesn't need to be innovated,
And so that would be my only you
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know, throw everything else out the
window. But even and then, you
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know, just because the thing is
popular now doesn't mean it's not future proofed.
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That's all what you know, especially
with us with manufacturing and even you
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know, that's always the dance that
we run with even our lighting fixtures.
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It's like, you know, we
have some that are our bread and butter,
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and you know, there's always that
resistance. There's always you're like,
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you want to keep it going because
it's your bread and butter. But then
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you have to think three, five, and ten years down the road at
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each of those points and say,
is it still going to be the best
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in those at those times, and
you know you have to start preparing,
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you know, And it's always it
always causes friction even in what we do.
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When you you know, I laugh
because like we have made our fixtures
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better, but it still upsets people. And you know, you're like,
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why are you up? Like it's
literally better, it's a better light,
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it's more value for you. Everything
is easier for you, and they're still
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upset because they have to change the
number on their piece of paper. Then
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they can't be bothered. It's also
because they now have to learn how to
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utilize the new equipment and they but
but again here you just have to process
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new stories you know, because they
could have. I mean, they could
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have. If they wanted to just
innovate Splash Mountain, they could have.
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They could have, you know,
they could have just renovated. Yeah.
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Well, the South has a ton
of stories that are that weren't represented.
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In fact, it only represents one
or two of the stories that are in
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Song of the South, So if
they wanted to upgrade it and keep the
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same story, they could have.
But I think they took a good opportunity.
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And you know, we were talking
earlier about we didn't know whether it
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was whether the change was done because
of the racist overtones of the of the
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previous story or because the ride needed
to be upgraded. But I don't care,
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because if the ride needed to be
upgraded, they could have just upgraded
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it with the same story, and
they didn't, So I think that's the
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right choice. Yeah, Okay,
moving on. Tait has announced that the
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private equity business at Goldman Sachs Alternatives
will acquire a majority stake in the company
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from affiliates of Providence Equity Partners,
subject to obtaining customary regulatory approvals. Financial
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details of the transaction were not disclosed, so that's basically the entire story.
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There's more in there. I mean, obviously, you know, if you
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know Sacks and you know Taate blah
blah blah, Tay is a big player
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in the entertainment design. I think
Scott and I have both come across them
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in different roles across our career in
the industry, so they are they have
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far reaching impact out there. I
think most consumers would recognize something they have
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built, for sure if you've been
in theme parks. So it's a pretty
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big it's a pretty big, long
reaching firm, and you know, I
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don't know if it's typical, but
yeah, we don't know anything else about
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it. But to me, it
does signal something that we have been talking
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about kind of I don't want to
say agnosiam but kind of in periphery for
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a while. Is that, you
know, if you look at the six
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Flag story we've talked about previously,
the big merger, you see there's a
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lot of interest there. Essentially,
what we've talked about for a while is
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the concept of you know, you
have these big companies that are vying over
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third place essentially in the streaming wars, which leads back to content and understanding
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how important content and live entertainment and
all that thing is. And so we
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know that Disney and Universal are up
there, and then we see that you
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know, this merger is hopefully going
to secure six flags. I think their
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plan at least is to make them
the third third thing. And then you
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know, Disney and so also control
their pieces of streaming, and so we'll
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see who the third streaming person is. But I think all this is clear
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that there is a tension for how
profitable a live entertainment division can be.
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And I think everybody is looking at
Disney, and I think the same thing
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we have talked about. They're looking
at Disney at their earnings and they are
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saying, well, if you take
streaming aside out of the Disney Company,
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these earnings are really good for things
entertainment. So there might be something to
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this. And talking about the future
proofing that we were just talking about,
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it's pretty future proof because there's not
you know, in the next few years,
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there's not going to be robots that
are going to be you know,
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I mean, there's it's live human
connection is going to be something that is
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pretty future proof from AI. It's
not gonna you know, it's pretty it's
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pretty future proofd and then when you
combine that with ips like we've been talking
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about, it's a really good business
model. So I'm not surprised at all
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that you see suddenly interest in investing
in these things. But I think it
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all comes back to what we also
talked about previously, which as which is
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one does not simply build a theme
park. It is not, you know,
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I think Wall Street. I think
sometimes Wall Street is a great predictive
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engine, but that doesn't mean they
understand the nuances of every industry. And
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I do think that same with Netflix. You know, it's not you know,
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one does not simply build a theme
park Netflix. It's not going to
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be easy to make a Disney park. You know. The reason that Disney
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that with everything we've been talking about, all this world and the I and
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all this crazy things. I mean, that is how Disney is able to
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be so profitable at this and so
you do not do that overnight, regardless
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of how much money Wall Street throws
at you. So that's money. Thank
359
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you for coming to me about that. And the thing I think is interesting
360
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is, you know, we when
we first started doing this show back in
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the Dark Ages, when we first
started doing this show, both Philip and
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I were concerned about the future of
theme park in general because it was you
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know, it was during COVID,
it was you know, we've done and
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and we were like, what's gonna
happen. What's gonna happen to me?
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Having a company like Golden Sax,
which is not and it's it is Golden
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Sex Alternatives, but still which is
not necessarily in the trenches when it comes
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to live entertainment. The fact that
they are interested and see value in owning
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the majority of shares in Tate because
Tate does you know, when Philip said,
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uh, you you all know things
that Tate's been involved in, that
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is true on so many levels,
because it's not just theme park. It's
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concerts, it's event production, it's
you know, uh, have you ever
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watched a Super Bowl? You know, it's it's all that kind of stuff.
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But it's all somehow entertainment or entertainment
adjacent. And if a company outside
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of the entertainment industry is willing and
interested and sees profitability in investing a company
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investing in a company that does this
kind of thing and does it on a
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grand scale, to me, that
more than anything, that shows that people
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who are much smarter than I am
when it comes to finances. See that
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there is a recovery here, and
see that there is a takeoff. And
379
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I will say it is not just
in the US, because you know,
380
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having having worked for a Tate subsidiary, a lot of what they do is
381
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you'll you'll probably never see if you're
an American life because it's they're doing a
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lot of work in the Middle East, they're doing a lot of they did
383
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a lot of work in China,
so they're doing a lot of international and
384
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they see international growth, you know, like with Jea's twenty thirty project in
385
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Saudi Arabia, for example, they
want they want to become a leader in
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the entertainment world in Saudi Arabia by
twenty thirty, and so that means they're
387
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going to be building gigantic theme parks. That means they're going to be basically
388
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creating an entertainment industry in their country, and they need somebody who knows how
389
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to do it, like a Taate
or a think Well, which is a
390
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Tape property. So Golden Saxis is
looking at this looking forward, going well,
391
00:28:42.680 --> 00:28:48.400
gosh, there's a lot of opportunity
here. We should probably get at
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least some stock here, and the
fact that they're going for controlling stock is
393
00:28:52.680 --> 00:28:56.440
very interesting. It's very interesting.
So to me, that is a very
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positive sign for our industry. Is
there I actually don't know this. I'm
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not sure that you sound Scott.
I think the difference would be Tait is
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not in the operations, right,
so it's really just the fabrication and the
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building. I mean, I guess
operations if it were a temporary thing like
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a concert or whatnot, but not
not like they're not staffed, like they're
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not running theme parks. They're not
staffing them. They're not like, no,
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they they go for the I always
like to say they're they're in the
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business of going from from nothing to
something huge. So it's that's what they
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that's what they So during this this
market where things are expanding, things are
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being built, things are explosively growing, that's where companies like Tate And again
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I am not a Tait expert.
I'm not even going to pretend to be,
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but companies like Tate, that's where
they thrive is in that as things
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start to expand, in that expansive
nature of the theme park an attractions industry
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and Golden Sacks obviously sees that and
like I said, much smarter when it
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comes to money than I am.
So they see that are investing in that,
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and to me, that is a
very good sign for our industry.
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And I think another good sign for
our industry is the fact that Philip and
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I get together and talk about it
every single week. But unfortunately we're done
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for this week, and because we're
we're out of time. So let's keep
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the industry going, and more importantly
to me personally, let's keep this show
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going. So please join us again
next week for Green Tag Theme Park in
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thirty on behalf of Philip Hernandez and
myself Scott Swinson. We will see you
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next week.
