Sept. 17, 2025

Halloween Trends 2025: What Guests Really Want (and What That Means for Your Attraction)

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Only 19% of U.S. adults say they want “scary vibes” this Halloween—while 30% plan to wear multiple costumes and 70% say organized events are steady or increasing. Philip and Scott unpack the annual HalloweenCostumes.com survey and why it matters: the demand for cute, funny, and cosplay-style experiences is growing faster than gore, audiences are starting to plan earlier, and AI is already a factor in how people search for inspiration. They also discuss how rising competition and budget-conscious consumers may shape event calendars, citing Six Flags Magic Mountain and Knott’s Scary Farm cutting weeknights while Hersheypark’s Dark Nights leans on bundled value and high-quality houses. The big question: with more families and casual fans in the market, can “giggles” and “cute” Halloween now generate more growth than scares? Listen to weekly BONUS episodes on our Patreon.

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Okay from our studios. This week, I'm back home in

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Los Angeles and Scott is in Tampa. This is Green

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Tag Theme Park and thirty. I'm Philip. He is Scott

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Swinson of Scott Swinson creat Development. On Green Tag, we

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look at the top theme park news each week and

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discuss why it matters to business professionals. And this week

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Halloween and more specifically, what a shocker. Well, I don't know,

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there was a cool, there was a cool this is

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a cool this is kind of a cool survey, and

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some cool survey results that we think are important and

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impactful to those of you who do Halloween events or

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are considering doing Halloween events. Yeah, so we're going to

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look at today on Todays show, We're going to look

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at some research in the Halloween space and then also

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combine that with some of my first hand experiences in

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Scott's experiences and kind of talk about a little bit

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of the evolution of Halloween events and where that could

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be going. Uh, and then potentially some six Flags news

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in at the very end or in our after show.

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So let's start off here.

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So I always emailed data from the Halloween Costumes dot Com,

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who does an annual survey. And just to give the specifics,

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it's a thousand people, a thousand adults in America that

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they did survey for this data. So it's not a

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huge sample size, but it is to I mean, that's

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the borderline for statistically significant is a thousand people. And

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that's a little bit larger I think than a lot

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of survey data that we see that isn't specialized in Halloween.

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Now keep in mind, right, this is coming from Halloween

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Costumes dot Com and it's primarily dealing with costumes and

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decor and those type of trends. So this is not

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immediately related to Ye, it's the consumer market. It's the

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consumer market, not the attractions market.

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That's right.

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But as we have said so many times, especially when

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it comes to Halloween and Christmas, consumer drives our market

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because people see the decorations and the stores and the

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retail I mean, the retail side of the of the

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events is much larger than the actual event side because

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everyone has access to retail et cetera, et cetera. So

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I pulled out some data I thought was the most interesting.

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First of all, is that only nineteen percent are having

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or looking at scary vibes. So basically the question was like,

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what is your vibe for Halloween this year? And the

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majority said that, you know, like funny and cozy, right,

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and then only nineteen percent said scary, So like that's

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that's the first signal, and the second is the raise

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rising in costumes, So thirty percent of the respondents are

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planning to wear two or more costumes this seasons and

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they attributed that actually to events or celebrations, which goes

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right into the next most interesting part, which is that

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seventy percent combined say that organized events are the same

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or increasing, but if you look in the data, forty

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percent of that are once they're saying there's more events,

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including haunted houses in their area that they are going

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to specifically going to, so you do see like a

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rise in that and there's more of them and people

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are interested in going to them, at least the forty

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percent of those people surveyed, which.

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I think is a big chunk.

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And then when it comes to planning, still most people

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shop in early October, right, however, a growing chunk that

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twenty five percent are after Labor Day and seventeen as

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early as August, which if you combine those together, right,

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that's like over forty percent that are doing it sometime

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between Labor Day and August, which is again that's again

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that's the creep that we've been talking about, the same

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that we're seeing here. When it comes to searching, I

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thought it was interesting that already in this year, AI

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tools make up eight percent of searches for people, and

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of course the main one is still online search, but

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AI tools are coming up in that. And then finally

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the thing that jumped out to me, so this was

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interesting because the press release talked about how people were

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spending more on Halloween and blah blah blah. But when

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I actually looked at the survey results and it broke

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it down, I would say it's different because when it

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comes to asking how many how much people are spending

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and keep in mind this is phrase is how much

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they're spending overall in Halloween, not just on decorations and costumes,

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so it's an overall number, and it said fifty one

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percent are doing the same roughly the same. Twenty two

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percent are spending more, which you would think is good,

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but twenty seven percent are spending less. So there's more

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people spending less than there are people spending more, and

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then you have a basic.

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You can't take but you can't take these numbers out

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of context. What was the what were these numbers last year?

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How is it? Is it trending up? Is it trending down?

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And that I can't answer. I don't know.

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So the survey is saying that it is trending up,

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but only slightly, you know. But then you have this

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idea of like, well if if you still have a

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chunk that are looking at spending less. You know, basically

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the survey is arguing that if you go back and look, basically,

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it's both are happening.

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Is that's going on.

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More people are paying less than more people are paying more.

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But they're going with the more people are paying more

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angle like that's what they're saying, Well, which it's true.

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Yeah, And I guess my point is if last year,

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if last year's survey results said only fifteen percent we're

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spending more, and this year twenty two percent are spending more,

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that means it's trending up. Yeah, you know, that means

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that we're we're people are spending more. So I think

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there's a lot of there's a lot of interesting things

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to dissect in this survey, and once again let's just

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talk where we recognize we're talking about a microcosm here,

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we recognize we're talking about a sample size of one thousand.

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We recognize we are not talking about attractions specifically, but

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this is attractions adjacent. So let's go back to only

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nineteen percent are doing scary themes.

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Yep.

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This so to me, this is fascinating but not surprising.

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I think that the reason scary themes are trending down

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is I think there are a couple of reasons. I

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think Number one, more and more people are looking to

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do family costumes and or family themes, especially if you're

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doing family parties or you know, parties with your kids,

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and it's it's much harder to for many people, for

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the vast majority of people to take their toddler and

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cover them in blood. You know, it's they just it's

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just not considered a whole lot of fun or classy

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or you know, it's it's it's becoming more and more difficult.

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I also think that people are looking for escape, and

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I think they're looking for escape from things that are terrifying,

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you know. I think there's enough going on in the

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world right now that is terrifying that they're they're shying

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away from it, interestingly enough, and this is anecdotal, it's

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just based on my memory, which I don't know whether

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i'd go there or not. But post nine to eleven,

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we trended away from trended away from scary and gore.

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So it kind of makes sense. It kind of makes

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sense that people, you know, are looking for things that

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are a little bit more, a little bit more fun.

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They're playing into the fantasy of Halloween, not necessarily the

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blood cuts and gore.

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I was thinking, similar to what you're saying about people

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thinking about the fancy of it, and I was thinking,

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what resonated to me about that is the attractions that

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are encouraging costumes, And we just talked about we did

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the episode on Premium Scream Night and Premium Scream Night

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this year allowed costumes, which Universal has never done in Florida.

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Well, I don't.

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I'm not gonna say they've never done it. To my

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knowledge that it has, they have not done allowed guestswear costumes.

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I don't know. Maybe they did it a long time ago.

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But that's different, right from Japan, which allows people to

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come in costumes. They do have costume guidelines, but they

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do allow it. And in Japan, what is it? It's

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all cute.

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I mean, it's the whole kawaii, you know, speaking there.

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And the costumes that I saw at Horror Nights for

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the Premium Screen night this year were not scary. They

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were like people dressed as stuff from five Nights at

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Freddy's to take photos with the photo ops. It was

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just you know, allusions to other characters or other things.

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It was more like representing, you know, a character that

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they like and then putting that character in.

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The world of of Horror Nites to take photos.

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Right.

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So it because it was interesting because because you do

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see that expansion, right, Mickey's not so scary Halloween party,

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We're about wearing costumes Okipligi bash. Everyone's wearing costumes. I mean,

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they're these This is becoming more of like a piece

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of the event Halloween event thing, which is to show

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up in costume, which then I think then directly ties

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to this research if you look at it in that right.

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Right well, And I also think it's important to recognize

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that there are more and more parks who are trying

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to to find their way if they've done the gross

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and terrifying, and then they're they're trying to edge their

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way into this this market. They're they're having a challenge

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because they're not quite sure how to do it. The

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moment you the moment you put a few drops of

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cute into an otherwise terrifying event, you counteract the terror.

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So Bush Gardens, Tampa, for example, is doing both a

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daytime trigger treat event and a nighttime yeah, blood, guts

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and gore event. Although even in some of the reviews,

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most of the reviews that I've read of both Horrorites

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and hallow Scream here in Florida is they say that

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Horrorites is the longest cues are for the haunts, and

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Hollow Scream the longest cues are for the rides. Uh.

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They basically said, people are going it appears as though,

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and again anecdotal, anecdotal, But I've read two different two

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or three different reviews, two for sure that said Hollow

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Scream is where you go to hang out kind of

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like I'm all in the nineties. That was one of

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the quotes, and Horror Nights is where you go for

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the hardcore horror people. However, in the same reviews they

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say that the haunts themselves are actually scarier at hallow

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scream than they are at.

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Horrorites because they're they're not congolining exactly exactly.

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So so it's it's an interesting it's an interesting push pull.

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And I've been doing a lot of I've been doing

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a lot of digging into this because this year and

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I have an expo in November, I'm doing an edge

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session called Giggles, Gasps, and Gore, and it's basically the

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three levels or three basic levels of Halloween Halloween activations

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in attractions, and it talks about you know, I've been

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exploring what are the advantages and disadvantages of all three

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of those levels, and you know, based on this data,

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they're the giggles part is trending up at least when

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it comes to people buying costumes and decor for their homes.

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They're they're more fun, they're out have you know, they're

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out to make people laugh as opposed to make people

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scream and cry.

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And I think that they're both also can be present.

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I mean in Hollywood, they brought over a Hami Kuma

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from Universal Studios Japan came over to Universal Studios Hollywood,

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and that's again like a horror. It's like a zombie

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Teddy Bear, right, And I think both can exist also

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in the same events, which is also new because previously

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you didn't you know, basically this year there are some

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of those elements combined with the horror at even events

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like Halloween hort Nits where there are those like funny,

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you know, silly moments that are combined together.

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Well, but funny fun I mean Bill and Ted you

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know was funny, but it was also very gory.

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It was also you get funny, very and funny cute, yeah,

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which is combining in these segments.

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Yeah, And I think if you put in too much

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funny cute, you end up watering down whatever other horror

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you've got going. If you bring in an element from

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another country that's been really popular, I think that's I

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think that's obviously fine, and that's going to be a

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workable solution. But if you try to, especially in your marketing,

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if you try to muddy the waters too much, you

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don't know who you're attracting. Yeah, and you don't want

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to attract you don't want to attract the twenty five

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year old who wants to go and get hammered and

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gets the crap scared out of him with mom and

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dad taking the kids to go trick or treating. That

234
00:12:36.600 --> 00:12:38.399
is that is a recipe for disaster.

235
00:12:39.360 --> 00:12:44.879
Well, speaking to that exact point, it's interesting that everyone

236
00:12:44.919 --> 00:12:48.799
is acknowledging that there are overall, you know, more events

237
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to go to, which means there's more competition. And it

238
00:12:53.000 --> 00:12:54.759
reminds me what when we last year we talked about

239
00:12:54.799 --> 00:12:56.200
Christmas and we I think we.

240
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Said something like Christmas is like just put lights on it.

241
00:13:01.399 --> 00:13:01.639
You know.

242
00:13:01.840 --> 00:13:05.120
It's like it's like everyone like it's like literally, it's

243
00:13:05.120 --> 00:13:08.120
like the meme would be like everybody now with lights.

244
00:13:08.519 --> 00:13:11.480
You know, Wendy's now with lights, you know, our freedom

245
00:13:11.559 --> 00:13:13.360
or this thing you normally go to, but like now

246
00:13:13.360 --> 00:13:16.200
we've added Christmas lights. I think it's more people are

247
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starting to do Halloween, and so you're the incompetition is increasing,

248
00:13:20.039 --> 00:13:20.720
which makes.

249
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It more important to not muddy your market.

250
00:13:23.440 --> 00:13:26.480
But this research also underscores what we've been talking about,

251
00:13:26.480 --> 00:13:29.399
which is that the market for non scary Halloween is

252
00:13:29.440 --> 00:13:32.159
actually larger than the market for scary Halloween right.

253
00:13:32.360 --> 00:13:34.799
Right, and it's and it's and it is continuing to grow.

254
00:13:34.879 --> 00:13:37.120
So that's why, like I said with with Bush, garden

255
00:13:37.159 --> 00:13:39.600
Stampa doing both. They're kind of trying to capture the

256
00:13:39.600 --> 00:13:44.080
best of both worlds, and it's I think training an

257
00:13:44.120 --> 00:13:46.960
audience for the future, you know, for the for the

258
00:13:47.039 --> 00:13:51.200
darker side in the future. I will say that, you know,

259
00:13:51.480 --> 00:13:58.480
and again anecdotally in my experience, the big money makers

260
00:13:58.759 --> 00:14:01.919
are the ones that are more toarifying because they target

261
00:14:01.960 --> 00:14:05.759
adults more and the adults spend more. However, that is

262
00:14:05.799 --> 00:14:09.639
shifting a little bit as well because the family friendly ones,

263
00:14:09.639 --> 00:14:11.840
the fun family friendly ones get mom and dad to

264
00:14:11.840 --> 00:14:16.320
buy the extra ice cream, to buy the extra cute whatever,

265
00:14:16.960 --> 00:14:18.960
the you know, the ears and the tail that the

266
00:14:19.039 --> 00:14:23.000
kids want. And so it's I guess, I guess. My

267
00:14:23.039 --> 00:14:25.960
point is there's room for all of this in this industry,

268
00:14:27.159 --> 00:14:30.320
and it's all becoming. It's all becoming, it's all becoming

269
00:14:30.440 --> 00:14:33.159
very profitable. Moving on to the next one, which is

270
00:14:33.200 --> 00:14:35.080
they plan to wear two or more costumes you know

271
00:14:35.200 --> 00:14:39.320
this season. To me, that just dives into what we've

272
00:14:39.320 --> 00:14:43.360
been talking about for months in various different topics, and

273
00:14:43.399 --> 00:14:45.639
that is the desire for people to do stuff. They

274
00:14:45.639 --> 00:14:47.679
want to be immersive, they want to be a part

275
00:14:47.720 --> 00:14:49.960
of versus going to go see so.

276
00:14:51.000 --> 00:14:53.639
And I actually think that actually incorporating that makes your

277
00:14:53.679 --> 00:14:58.320
event overall more attractive also because then again it it's

278
00:14:58.360 --> 00:15:00.799
an easy way to add a forma of interactivity that

279
00:15:00.840 --> 00:15:04.480
you're saying, but it again, it gives us something to

280
00:15:04.600 --> 00:15:11.879
do because again they can do, like be bring a

281
00:15:11.919 --> 00:15:14.399
costume to then participate in the event in some way

282
00:15:14.480 --> 00:15:19.279
or take pictures or or or whatever. But I do

283
00:15:19.360 --> 00:15:21.320
think you see that trend over all though, I mean,

284
00:15:21.360 --> 00:15:23.519
because we were talking over the summer, we talked about

285
00:15:23.600 --> 00:15:26.759
comic Con and that whole thing. I mean, it's no

286
00:15:26.799 --> 00:15:30.720
different than cosplay. I mean, honestly, like, I do think

287
00:15:30.799 --> 00:15:34.120
it's pretty similar. The idea of costplaying at a convention

288
00:15:34.320 --> 00:15:36.519
and putting a costume on for a Halloween event.

289
00:15:36.559 --> 00:15:38.159
I think they're they're pretty now.

290
00:15:38.159 --> 00:15:39.679
The one thing, the one thing though that if you

291
00:15:39.720 --> 00:15:41.559
are going to if you are thinking about allowing this,

292
00:15:42.000 --> 00:15:44.320
just to make sure that your security just trained differently,

293
00:15:45.080 --> 00:15:49.000
because one of the challenges back in you know, back

294
00:15:49.080 --> 00:15:51.159
back in the day, back in the hell screen days,

295
00:15:51.440 --> 00:15:53.120
we did not let guests come in costume, and that

296
00:15:53.240 --> 00:15:56.279
was because they would try to become a little too involved.

297
00:15:57.159 --> 00:15:59.759
They would start scaring other guests, and there is a

298
00:15:59.840 --> 00:16:04.039
huge huge legal liability there if a guest scares another

299
00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:06.080
guest that we as a park had no control over

300
00:16:06.679 --> 00:16:09.360
and they and the other guests gets injured. So you

301
00:16:09.480 --> 00:16:11.600
got to just kind of retrain and rethink how your

302
00:16:11.600 --> 00:16:15.320
security is working. Make sure that those costumes do not

303
00:16:15.440 --> 00:16:19.639
have anything that can either intentionally or unintentionally become a weapon.

304
00:16:22.399 --> 00:16:24.320
But again, if more and more people are going cute,

305
00:16:24.679 --> 00:16:27.919
then then that's the I have a I have a

306
00:16:27.919 --> 00:16:30.000
brand news client which happens to be a zoo. It's

307
00:16:30.039 --> 00:16:33.279
a very family friendly event. And one of the things

308
00:16:33.320 --> 00:16:38.120
that I've seen in in their in their their media

309
00:16:38.159 --> 00:16:41.039
and b roll shoots, as well as heard from the

310
00:16:41.159 --> 00:16:45.159
staff is they are shocked as to how many families

311
00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:48.519
dress up together. Yep, I think that is a bigger

312
00:16:48.559 --> 00:16:52.480
and bigger trend. Now I have really odd and quirky friends,

313
00:16:52.559 --> 00:16:59.600
So I have I have one family who is one

314
00:16:59.639 --> 00:17:04.240
of the the youngest Sun or the Sun wanted to

315
00:17:04.279 --> 00:17:12.440
be one of the the the plague doctors wanted to

316
00:17:12.440 --> 00:17:14.920
be one of the So Mom is going as a

317
00:17:14.920 --> 00:17:18.000
witch being burned at the Steak and Dad is going

318
00:17:18.079 --> 00:17:22.640
as an inquisitor in the Red Road. So again it's

319
00:17:22.640 --> 00:17:24.799
sort of it's still dark, but it's still kind of

320
00:17:24.839 --> 00:17:29.359
tongue in cheek dark because being the costume of being

321
00:17:29.359 --> 00:17:32.359
burned to the steak, for example, is she has on

322
00:17:32.480 --> 00:17:34.839
the steak and then has the fire is her hoopskirt

323
00:17:34.960 --> 00:17:38.640
which has lights in it that light up. I suggested

324
00:17:38.680 --> 00:17:40.440
a mini fogger because I think that would be really cool,

325
00:17:40.640 --> 00:17:43.119
but well, well.

326
00:17:43.119 --> 00:17:45.359
Yeah, I think you know, group costumes are a huge thing.

327
00:17:45.359 --> 00:17:48.079
And it reminds me to again back to what we

328
00:17:48.079 --> 00:17:50.680
talked about with the cosplay, which is that there's so

329
00:17:52.799 --> 00:17:55.880
that is its own form of entertainment right where you're

330
00:17:55.920 --> 00:17:58.960
seeing more and more conventions lean more and more into

331
00:17:59.000 --> 00:18:01.240
that because they don't have to do anything right, They

332
00:18:01.319 --> 00:18:03.240
just they just are like, we're going to have a

333
00:18:03.240 --> 00:18:05.599
cosplay showcase, and what is that? They were like one

334
00:18:05.640 --> 00:18:07.960
staff member to put them all on, you know, I

335
00:18:07.960 --> 00:18:10.720
mean it's the guests are bringing the entertainment and a.

336
00:18:10.680 --> 00:18:12.640
Photo op with a photo op with the logo of the.

337
00:18:12.559 --> 00:18:15.640
Event yep, and then it's a bunch of entertainment and

338
00:18:15.640 --> 00:18:17.000
it adds just to the mood of it. And I

339
00:18:17.039 --> 00:18:20.200
think that if you're following down what we talked about

340
00:18:20.359 --> 00:18:24.680
last week, which is universal becoming more of a festival

341
00:18:24.759 --> 00:18:27.039
or bringing more of that thing. Again, what are other

342
00:18:27.119 --> 00:18:30.319
big things? Other big things are conventions And if you

343
00:18:30.440 --> 00:18:32.440
want to tap into more of that vibe, I could

344
00:18:32.440 --> 00:18:32.920
see this.

345
00:18:34.200 --> 00:18:37.119
And that, you know, moving moving through this this study here,

346
00:18:37.200 --> 00:18:42.680
seventy percent say that they that they're they are organizing

347
00:18:42.680 --> 00:18:46.680
events that are either the same or increasing. That also

348
00:18:46.839 --> 00:18:48.880
kind of leans into that we want to be more

349
00:18:48.880 --> 00:18:51.119
a part of it. So they're creating their own events,

350
00:18:51.119 --> 00:18:53.359
They're creating their own parties, they're creating their own gatherings,

351
00:18:53.359 --> 00:18:57.720
their own get togethers. But and and you know, the

352
00:18:57.759 --> 00:19:00.640
shopping does not surprise me at all. I will tell you,

353
00:19:00.680 --> 00:19:02.440
if you are in the thirteen percent that start the

354
00:19:02.440 --> 00:19:07.000
week before Halloween, you're going to get what you get.

355
00:19:08.039 --> 00:19:09.960
I don't go in there with with a popular ip

356
00:19:10.680 --> 00:19:12.440
in your brain, because you won't walk out with it

357
00:19:12.480 --> 00:19:13.359
in your shopping bag.

358
00:19:13.720 --> 00:19:16.160
Just so yeah, that's it.

359
00:19:16.240 --> 00:19:17.039
Yeah, there's that.

360
00:19:17.119 --> 00:19:20.240
And then search also does not surprise me. I think

361
00:19:20.359 --> 00:19:22.279
that's also very similar to what we see for search

362
00:19:22.279 --> 00:19:22.799
for events.

363
00:19:22.839 --> 00:19:23.119
Also.

364
00:19:23.440 --> 00:19:26.319
I mean it's always funny because in most of the

365
00:19:26.319 --> 00:19:30.279
world I deal with, it's the you know, YouTube, it's

366
00:19:30.279 --> 00:19:32.279
a social media sphere, which is which if you add

367
00:19:32.319 --> 00:19:34.960
them together, is still less that you know in this

368
00:19:35.079 --> 00:19:37.240
then the I know this is about costumes, which is

369
00:19:38.039 --> 00:19:42.319
a different thing, but it's very similar in nature, and

370
00:19:42.359 --> 00:19:44.559
that people are still searching, like things to do in

371
00:19:44.599 --> 00:19:47.839
my town or areas or whatever, and so sir, you

372
00:19:47.839 --> 00:19:52.319
know that. I think we sometimes forget how important just

373
00:19:52.400 --> 00:19:56.079
the regular old marketing is, as in your buying advertising,

374
00:19:56.640 --> 00:19:58.799
you know, to advertise to people who are looking for

375
00:19:58.880 --> 00:20:03.680
things to do right in your sector. And yeah, and

376
00:20:03.720 --> 00:20:08.480
the spending less, so that thing, you know, twenty seven

377
00:20:08.519 --> 00:20:12.119
percent spending less, I think that's that's a significant chunk.

378
00:20:12.160 --> 00:20:14.079
That's you know, over a quarter is going to be

379
00:20:14.119 --> 00:20:17.519
spending less. And we talked about that also. I think

380
00:20:17.519 --> 00:20:21.079
we are I think the answer is we don't know yet,

381
00:20:21.119 --> 00:20:24.039
Like no one knows how Halloween spending is going to

382
00:20:24.119 --> 00:20:28.799
shake out, you know, are people going to choose less

383
00:20:28.799 --> 00:20:31.839
events or less decor or like where is the spending

384
00:20:31.880 --> 00:20:34.039
being cut if it is, and are they still going

385
00:20:34.119 --> 00:20:36.200
to do like the traditional like the event that they

386
00:20:36.200 --> 00:20:39.000
always do. I mean we talked about this with horonites, right,

387
00:20:39.039 --> 00:20:42.440
like eleven dollars cheese sticks is crazy and the hornite

388
00:20:42.440 --> 00:20:45.240
is so expensive, but premium scream Nights sold out, So like,

389
00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:46.720
how do those people? I don't even I still know

390
00:20:46.759 --> 00:20:50.039
how people paid for that? And will that can who

391
00:20:50.119 --> 00:20:53.640
have no idea? The only thing that came out this week? Yeah,

392
00:20:53.680 --> 00:20:54.480
I can mention the.

393
00:20:55.359 --> 00:20:57.039
Just real quick though, with on the on the spending,

394
00:20:57.160 --> 00:20:58.880
the thing that we also have to take into consideration

395
00:20:59.039 --> 00:21:03.559
is the twenty seven percent that are spending less and

396
00:21:03.720 --> 00:21:07.079
the twenty two percent that are spending more? Does that

397
00:21:07.160 --> 00:21:09.000
not flat line? Do those not cancel out? Yeah?

398
00:21:09.039 --> 00:21:10.319
That's right, it almost flat lines?

399
00:21:10.599 --> 00:21:13.400
So that was that would be another argument, which is

400
00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:17.200
that if anything, it's flatline and slightly down, like two

401
00:21:17.319 --> 00:21:18.119
or three percent down.

402
00:21:18.359 --> 00:21:20.400
But is that I can see how people would interpret

403
00:21:20.400 --> 00:21:23.839
this as, oh my gosh, they're spending less and making

404
00:21:23.839 --> 00:21:26.680
some knee jerk responses and knee jerk reactions. And in fact,

405
00:21:26.680 --> 00:21:28.640
we were talking just before the show about a couple

406
00:21:28.680 --> 00:21:32.920
of different attractions that have already started to make these

407
00:21:33.200 --> 00:21:35.359
kinds of alterations. Philip, you've got the data on that,

408
00:21:35.400 --> 00:21:36.039
don't you. I think?

409
00:21:36.160 --> 00:21:36.400
Yeah?

410
00:21:36.400 --> 00:21:38.319
And then the question though, is are they making those

411
00:21:38.480 --> 00:21:42.079
based off of data, predictive data, or are they doing

412
00:21:42.119 --> 00:21:44.279
it based like how are they making so? So the

413
00:21:44.319 --> 00:21:47.079
thing we were going to mention and this ties to

414
00:21:47.160 --> 00:21:49.519
Six Flags, which we will be talking about by the

415
00:21:49.519 --> 00:21:53.680
next show. But so here locally, I'm in Los Angeles market.

416
00:21:53.720 --> 00:21:57.440
We have the two six Flags properties, which is Magic

417
00:21:57.480 --> 00:22:01.319
Mountain and then not Berry Farm, so because now after

418
00:22:01.359 --> 00:22:05.400
the merger, they're will in the same market. So essentially,

419
00:22:05.480 --> 00:22:08.319
what happened this last week, which was not reported on

420
00:22:08.440 --> 00:22:11.440
by many people in the largest here but US just

421
00:22:11.519 --> 00:22:16.680
locally found out about it, is that Magic Mountain has

422
00:22:16.720 --> 00:22:19.559
cut all their Thursday days from their calendar and they

423
00:22:19.599 --> 00:22:23.359
have been rearranging it to get rebook people or to

424
00:22:23.400 --> 00:22:25.319
get refunds or you know, they've been trying to rearrange

425
00:22:25.319 --> 00:22:28.599
tickets for that. And then meanwhile down at not Scary Farm,

426
00:22:29.200 --> 00:22:32.079
they have removed all the Wednesdays from their calendars and

427
00:22:32.160 --> 00:22:35.440
Thursdays are still available for now on Scary Farm, but

428
00:22:35.759 --> 00:22:38.599
Scary Farmer is a much larger event also, so I

429
00:22:38.640 --> 00:22:41.759
would expect that would be fine, but I noticed it

430
00:22:41.799 --> 00:22:43.559
and then I verified it with a few other people

431
00:22:43.559 --> 00:22:44.440
and people you know.

432
00:22:44.599 --> 00:22:45.680
It's here locally.

433
00:22:45.839 --> 00:22:49.319
It's a big thing because even me, I was trying

434
00:22:49.319 --> 00:22:51.839
to change dates for an event with Notts and it

435
00:22:51.880 --> 00:22:52.519
has been.

436
00:22:54.160 --> 00:22:54.880
Sidebar on that.

437
00:22:54.960 --> 00:22:58.559
It has been the most terrible experience I've almost ever

438
00:22:58.599 --> 00:23:03.319
had trying to change dates at at knots. It's it's ridiculous.

439
00:23:03.720 --> 00:23:05.880
There's no one to call. You have to email their

440
00:23:05.880 --> 00:23:09.400
support line to change the date, and they they take

441
00:23:09.799 --> 00:23:13.759
on average four days to reply. Uh. And then they're like, oh, no,

442
00:23:13.839 --> 00:23:16.160
this information, we need this. I mean, it's crazy, Like

443
00:23:16.200 --> 00:23:19.519
it's I don't like, that's just a whole separate conversation

444
00:23:19.599 --> 00:23:21.880
about they should just be using AI at this point

445
00:23:21.920 --> 00:23:23.359
if it's going to be this bad, or they need

446
00:23:23.400 --> 00:23:24.599
to have a better This is crazy.

447
00:23:24.599 --> 00:23:27.160
They have a better system, And this is why six

448
00:23:27.559 --> 00:23:28.160
is the only one.

449
00:23:28.799 --> 00:23:30.279
It suggests to me that you're not the only one

450
00:23:30.279 --> 00:23:31.279
trying to change dates too.

451
00:23:31.319 --> 00:23:33.079
So there's that that's true.

452
00:23:33.079 --> 00:23:36.480
But then also this is why six Flags is going

453
00:23:36.640 --> 00:23:37.960
down the shitter, right, they need.

454
00:23:38.160 --> 00:23:39.880
But here's the but here's here's the other side of

455
00:23:39.920 --> 00:23:42.240
that too. Is is it? And I don't know the

456
00:23:42.240 --> 00:23:45.559
answer to this. Is it because they're they're concerned that

457
00:23:45.759 --> 00:23:47.759
the Halloween spend is going to be less? Is it

458
00:23:47.799 --> 00:23:50.680
because for the first time since the merger, really they've

459
00:23:50.720 --> 00:23:53.839
got to uh, they've got two parks they're in competition

460
00:23:53.880 --> 00:23:56.880
with one another, So in order to ease some of that,

461
00:23:57.680 --> 00:24:01.240
they don't need to have the extra nights. But I

462
00:24:01.279 --> 00:24:03.720
will say that, you know, cutting nights there's a there's

463
00:24:03.799 --> 00:24:08.640
there's pluses and minuses to to reducing the run of

464
00:24:08.680 --> 00:24:13.000
a show. Because Halloween events are usually very labor heavy,

465
00:24:14.160 --> 00:24:17.759
there is there is some savings in reducing nights. However,

466
00:24:18.000 --> 00:24:20.759
that means that you have to admortize your capital. That

467
00:24:20.799 --> 00:24:23.880
means you have to spend less capital because you don't

468
00:24:23.960 --> 00:24:26.480
have the the earning power if you have fewer if

469
00:24:26.480 --> 00:24:29.440
you're open fewer nights, So you have to make sure

470
00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:33.920
that your your capital spend gets adjusted accordingly. Now, obviously

471
00:24:33.960 --> 00:24:36.079
if they're making the change at the last minute, they're

472
00:24:36.119 --> 00:24:38.039
not thinking about that, but it will come into play

473
00:24:38.039 --> 00:24:40.960
next year, you know, if they continue to do it.

474
00:24:41.440 --> 00:24:44.680
So because you know, we there there is there is

475
00:24:44.720 --> 00:24:48.279
a certain logic to we're spending this money to install

476
00:24:48.279 --> 00:24:50.839
this stuff, we might as well have as many nights

477
00:24:50.880 --> 00:24:54.680
as possible to to potentially earn the money back. But

478
00:24:55.480 --> 00:24:58.599
since Halloween events are labor heavy, you know, when you

479
00:24:58.640 --> 00:25:01.160
don't have an opening, when you don't have a night

480
00:25:01.160 --> 00:25:05.200
that you're open, then your labor costs go down. The

481
00:25:05.240 --> 00:25:06.720
other thing that I think is going to be interesting,

482
00:25:06.759 --> 00:25:09.440
and we won't see this until next year, the or

483
00:25:09.480 --> 00:25:13.519
future years, is when it comes to staffing. If you've

484
00:25:13.559 --> 00:25:16.720
promised people a certain number of nights and a certain

485
00:25:17.160 --> 00:25:21.119
amount of income during the season and you reduce that

486
00:25:21.279 --> 00:25:24.880
by one night a week, are they going to come

487
00:25:24.920 --> 00:25:29.400
back to work for you again next year? So and

488
00:25:29.440 --> 00:25:31.960
I've worked in situations where it has impacted it, and

489
00:25:32.000 --> 00:25:33.799
I've worked in situations where it hasn't been a darn thing.

490
00:25:34.240 --> 00:25:37.839
So just just something to kind of think about be

491
00:25:37.960 --> 00:25:42.000
aware of, because if you keep if you keep making

492
00:25:42.079 --> 00:25:46.119
changes last minute, those people that you rely on to

493
00:25:46.119 --> 00:25:50.119
make your event special may turn their attention elsewhere.

494
00:25:50.960 --> 00:25:51.640
Well. It is.

495
00:25:53.359 --> 00:25:55.960
I think all those points of valid especially about them

496
00:25:56.079 --> 00:25:58.720
competing in the same market and how that maybe changed

497
00:25:58.759 --> 00:26:02.039
the dynamics, which I think it's probably the strongest argument.

498
00:26:04.119 --> 00:26:05.480
Like you said, it's the most logical yea.

499
00:26:06.039 --> 00:26:07.839
And like you said, there's we're not gonna know. We're

500
00:26:07.880 --> 00:26:10.759
just not gonna know until ayappa. Right when people start

501
00:26:10.799 --> 00:26:13.319
discussing or you talk about how you're whatever, we're not

502
00:26:13.359 --> 00:26:13.720
gonna know.

503
00:26:14.079 --> 00:26:15.039
I will say.

504
00:26:16.599 --> 00:26:19.799
That ugi BIGI bash you know, and they expanded their

505
00:26:19.880 --> 00:26:21.960
nights this year, right and most of them have sold

506
00:26:21.960 --> 00:26:25.839
out still and that Halloween Horn Nights is still running

507
00:26:27.279 --> 00:26:30.799
every night except Monday and Tuesday in both markets and

508
00:26:30.920 --> 00:26:33.680
they have not reduced yet. And then obviously Premium sold out.

509
00:26:33.759 --> 00:26:38.359
So that is an interesting where you're again seeing this bifurcationing,

510
00:26:38.599 --> 00:26:44.200
bifurcating thing happening where you're getting And then we previously

511
00:26:44.200 --> 00:26:46.640
remember we talked about the other properties that have cut

512
00:26:46.759 --> 00:26:48.920
Christmas or cut Halloween and the other.

513
00:26:48.759 --> 00:26:49.559
Six Flags properties.

514
00:26:49.599 --> 00:26:52.839
So it does I could see your argument about the

515
00:26:53.400 --> 00:26:56.119
double market thing. I could also see it with what

516
00:26:56.160 --> 00:26:59.519
they said back then, which is that there they need

517
00:26:59.519 --> 00:27:02.039
to trim operating times right now.

518
00:27:02.160 --> 00:27:04.279
And well and when you and when when you go

519
00:27:04.359 --> 00:27:11.960
into a a challenging market, the high end does not

520
00:27:12.079 --> 00:27:18.720
see it. I mean, you know, during during during COVID,

521
00:27:18.759 --> 00:27:25.519
for example, auto sales went down for certain for certain

522
00:27:25.559 --> 00:27:28.960
brands went down significantly. Jaguar was not touched. They did

523
00:27:28.960 --> 00:27:32.920
not lose any market share. They kept the same. So

524
00:27:34.480 --> 00:27:38.200
it's interesting. Pains why it explains why the Disney product

525
00:27:38.240 --> 00:27:42.960
and the Universal product are still doing bang up business.

526
00:27:42.960 --> 00:27:46.920
They're still selling out, they're still keeping all their nights. Now,

527
00:27:47.119 --> 00:27:50.079
if this trend continues, it may impact them, but it's

528
00:27:50.079 --> 00:27:51.079
certainly not done it yet.

529
00:27:51.599 --> 00:27:51.799
Yep.

530
00:27:53.319 --> 00:27:58.680
Uh, let's see. So really quick, we're almost at a time.

531
00:27:58.720 --> 00:28:03.359
But just I did vis it a few places this

532
00:28:03.440 --> 00:28:04.920
weekend before I came back into town.

533
00:28:05.799 --> 00:28:06.519
It is really quick.

534
00:28:06.559 --> 00:28:10.240
The Dark Knights opened at Hershey Park and I went

535
00:28:10.279 --> 00:28:11.319
there for the opening night.

536
00:28:11.440 --> 00:28:13.799
And that event, again, that continues.

537
00:28:13.440 --> 00:28:16.039
To encapsulate a lot of what we're talking about that

538
00:28:16.079 --> 00:28:19.640
we've been talking about. It's such an enormous value for guests,

539
00:28:19.640 --> 00:28:22.599
which is always the first thing I think about, because

540
00:28:23.559 --> 00:28:26.079
they have this year, they have five hundred houses, four

541
00:28:26.119 --> 00:28:29.200
scare zones, they have a stage show, they have trick

542
00:28:29.240 --> 00:28:33.079
or treating, and then they have the slider showcase from

543
00:28:33.160 --> 00:28:36.480
Decayed Brigade. All of that is included in a day ticket.

544
00:28:37.000 --> 00:28:40.920
And so it's again it's back to that old model

545
00:28:41.400 --> 00:28:44.319
of just enormous amounts of value.

546
00:28:44.359 --> 00:28:46.079
I mean, like it's five hundred houses.

547
00:28:45.880 --> 00:28:49.759
And again to underscore they are good plus you have

548
00:28:49.759 --> 00:28:50.720
to taken them consideration.

549
00:28:50.880 --> 00:28:51.720
Plus the park.

550
00:28:52.319 --> 00:28:54.759
Yeah, well exactly, so they have fifty rides, you know,

551
00:28:55.000 --> 00:28:56.960
and that are open. The food and beverage, I mean,

552
00:28:57.000 --> 00:29:00.480
the whole it's it's like the Halloween event is. It's

553
00:29:00.519 --> 00:29:05.079
just it's just additive, Like it's entirely additive, just on

554
00:29:06.359 --> 00:29:09.200
top of your season passes. There's no extra not like

555
00:29:09.440 --> 00:29:11.720
again like six Flags charging extra for hot houses, Like

556
00:29:11.759 --> 00:29:14.799
there's no up charge for any of this. And also

557
00:29:15.119 --> 00:29:18.960
the houses are better. I mean again going they might

558
00:29:19.039 --> 00:29:21.119
not be better than Nots, but I would say they're close.

559
00:29:21.480 --> 00:29:25.720
They're very close to and I actually would argue that

560
00:29:25.759 --> 00:29:28.039
the new Haunted house they built this series is better

561
00:29:28.079 --> 00:29:31.880
than Nots Mace's. The quality is incredible. For the new

562
00:29:31.920 --> 00:29:34.200
Haunted House that they have this year, which is all

563
00:29:34.279 --> 00:29:36.920
kill and Field garage and it's all themes for old

564
00:29:37.680 --> 00:29:40.799
gas station HARKing back to Hershey's Pass because some of

565
00:29:40.839 --> 00:29:43.160
the owners had gas stations, they owned some gas stations.

566
00:29:43.200 --> 00:29:44.920
It's a very historic gas station.

567
00:29:45.039 --> 00:29:47.160
And there's just what's going on in this garage and

568
00:29:47.519 --> 00:29:51.920
there's really you know, neat scenes in there, just really

569
00:29:51.960 --> 00:29:56.319
fun moments in that and it's still scary again it's scary,

570
00:29:56.319 --> 00:29:57.880
but then they still have the cue. It's all these

571
00:29:57.880 --> 00:30:00.200
things combined. You have the cute and stuff. If you

572
00:30:00.240 --> 00:30:02.799
can wear costumes to the event, it's included added value

573
00:30:02.799 --> 00:30:04.799
for people are spending more or less. If they want

574
00:30:04.839 --> 00:30:06.759
to spend more, they can just buy dining. They have

575
00:30:06.839 --> 00:30:09.960
upgraded dining this year, dining passes. I mean, it's literally

576
00:30:10.400 --> 00:30:12.839
a full microcosm of everything we've.

577
00:30:12.680 --> 00:30:13.240
Been talking about.

578
00:30:13.680 --> 00:30:16.720
Yep, and it's working, so that's a good thing. Speaking

579
00:30:16.799 --> 00:30:18.720
of working, we've been working for the last half hour

580
00:30:18.759 --> 00:30:21.079
and it's time for us to move on. So guys,

581
00:30:21.079 --> 00:30:23.400
thank you all so much. And for those of you

582
00:30:23.440 --> 00:30:27.440
who are fans and supporters of Unhinged, we're going to

583
00:30:27.480 --> 00:30:29.519
go record that and see what comes out of our

584
00:30:29.559 --> 00:30:31.640
mouths there. But for the rest of you, thank you

585
00:30:31.720 --> 00:30:33.359
so much, and hopefully we'll see you next week on

586
00:30:33.400 --> 00:30:35.279
behalf of Philip and myself. This is Green Tag Theme

587
00:30:35.319 --> 00:30:37.799
Park and thirty and we will see you next week.